cockbeard wrote:

It's the "I need to investigate a trespass", no son, no you really don't, unless of course trespass has been reported. Obviously there's different laws in UK and US, but trespass over here is a civil matter

Before I go any further, let me be absolutely clear that the cop in that video is unquestionably in the wrong. He started in the wrong, and kept getting wronger. It’s concerning that somebody with that loose a grasp of what is reasonable was given a gun and a badge.

But, in direct response to cocko, it’s worth noting that it would be a neglect of duty if a police officer reasonably suspected a crime was being committed and didn’t investigate. So, saying “I need to investigate x/y/z,” isn’t necessarily wrong if no report of x/y/z has been received.

As for trespass, while it isn’t necessarily criminal in and off itself, there are a few laws which create criminal offences closely related to trespass.

Andy wrote:

cockbeard wrote:

It's the "I need to investigate a trespass", no son, no you really don't, unless of course trespass has been reported. Obviously there's different laws in UK and US, but trespass over here is a civil matter

But, in direct response to cocko, it’s worth noting that it would be a neglect of duty if a police officer reasonably suspected a crime was being committed and didn’t investigate. So, saying “I need to investigate x/y/z,” isn’t necessarily wrong if no report of x/y/z has been received.

As for trespass, while it isn’t necessarily criminal in and off itself, there are a few laws which create criminal offences closely related to trespass.

Cops never think their suspicion is unreasonable. The key word is reasonable. There has to be an objectively established suspicion.

We all know what went on here. The guy went with his gut. The way the "suspect" answers back, instead of making him realise his suspicions are unreasonable, makes him feel silly. We all know the worst thing to do to a cop is to make him realise he is a silly, silly man who doesn't know many things. They don't react well.

Whatever you say, boss

I know you think you’re being clever, Gonzo, and you’re trying to wind me up to prove a point, but it’s not working. It’s a bit pathetic, really.

b0r1s wrote:

Do you honestly think there is parity with the US?

They’ve obviously got a disproportionately larger problem, with more serious consequences when it goes wrong. And I’m aware of just how draconian their legal system is. But, considering the number of incidents Police must attend across that country every day, there must be a considerable number being resolved in unremarkable fashion.

I think you’re misreading what I’m saying a little bit, Boris.

I don’t believe that they have more of a problem just because of a larger population. I suspect they have proportionally more racist/corrupt/power-mad cops than here, because they appear to have a system that allows the bad cops to persist and prosper. So, no, I don’t believe that more negative stories are highlighted just because of the numbers; it’s fairly clear that it’s proportionally a bigger and more serious problem.

And I don’t doubt that a number of incidents go by where people are treated unfairly/harshly but they just keep their heads down and say nothing. But I don’t think it’s fair to infer that the calls go one of those two ways.

I do realise the pitfalls of a #notallcops argument, but I don’t think it’s reasonable or helpful to adopt a blanket stance.

b0r1s wrote:

It’s that vague bullshit about an object. Calling something and object and potential weapon is obvious training so that if they fuck up they don’t have to add context to the fact that the guy was picking up leaves with a rubbish collector stick.

 
I have to be honest, if I'm wanting to smash someone, I will make a point of saying some vague crap about feeling threatened a couple of times, in my head it opens the door to potentially allowing self-defence to be taken into account. Doesn't make it morally ok, but makes me think I'm covering my arse. Intent is much more difficult (if not impossible) to prove.

Armitage_Shankburn wrote:

We all know the worst thing to do to a cop is to make him realise he is a silly, silly man who doesn't know many things. They don't react well.

This reminded me of that bit in Congo where the gorilla would attack police officers, on the premise that anyone dressed so stupidly obviously deserves derision rather than respect. Called them button men due to the amount and shininess of the buttons they wore

Yep.

I think they said something about someone fitting my description being involved in a crime?

Couldn’t say for sure now, it was over two decades ago.

The reason why I mention it, is because I think this is exactly right...

davyK wrote:

Everyone in America does seem to be afraid. What of I'm not so sure. Well - not everyone - it's probably a huge chunk of the white side of the population.

And this... 

davyK wrote:

It must be a real grind. Soul destroying. It's understandable why someone would have had enough of it and make a stand. I know I'm not a good example because being stopped by police and army and questioned as to who I was , where I was coming from and where I was going was an all part and parcel of life. I'm probably programmed to be compliant. Difference is , everyone was treated the same way. Although depending on your name and where you where you may well have been delayed and questioned further.

Davy knows what the fuck is up.

There's a time and a place for stop and search, but the process in America is biased, broken, and it's costing innocent lives.

I was on my way home from work as it happened, but I was selling records not sweeping chimneys.

dynamiteReady wrote:

The reason why I mention it, is because I think this is exactly right...

Everyone in America does seem to be afraid. What of I'm not so sure. Well - not everyone - it's probably a huge chunk of the white side of the population.

And this... 

It must be a real grind. Soul destroying. It's understandable why someone would have had enough of it and make a stand. I know I'm not a good example because being stopped by police and army and questioned as to who I was , where I was coming from and where I was going was an all part and parcel of life. I'm probably programmed to be compliant. Difference is , everyone was treated the same way. Although depending on your name and where you where you may well have been delayed and questioned further.

Davy knows what the fuck is up. There's a time and a place for stop and search, but the process in America is biased, broken, and it's costing innocent lives.

Not a single word wrong here.

It has indeed gone in both.

Andy ngo getting assaulted in Portland takes have fallen down party lines then.

Also, semi related, it's fucking amazing how easily duped/convinced new athiest/na adjacent folks are by nazis.

Michael shermer up on twitter talking about how the nazi party were socialists.