Weird Stuff (tinfoil hat wearing goons only, please)
  • Kow wrote:
    It's not instead, just as well. Fantasy, myth, sci fi are all great.

    They are, but allowing them to distort or disrupt our perception of the real world is problematic.
  • Kow
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    I guess the unknown is subjective but I take your point. Although I'd go with aliens before I'd go with God.
  • dynamiteReady
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    Andy wrote:
    It's not instead, just as well. Fantasy, myth, sci fi are all great.
    They are, but allowing them to distort or disrupt our perception of the real world is problematic.

    Well... Now that you take it there, the 'real world', for many, can be the most corrupt, distorted, horrific and unfair of all constructs at times.

    Can't blame another for wanting to escape that, if there's no way of changing it.
    "I didn't get it. BUUUUUUUUUUUT, you fucking do your thing." - Roujin
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  • Kow wrote:
    I guess the unknown is subjective but I take your point. Although I'd go with aliens before I'd go with God.

    Depends where I suppose.
  • bad_hair_day
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    Grand to see folks engaging this interesting (to me) thing.

    Very detailed read vouching for the credibility of Fravor and his crew's testimony -

    On March 14th, 2015 the fighter pilot trade magazine website “Fighter Sweep” had an article titled “There I was: The X-Files Edition” that recounted the Nimitz Encounters. The article was written by Ret. Naval Aviator and friends of Dave Fravor, Francesco “Paco” Cherici..The full article can be read here: https://fightersweep.com/1460/x-files-edition/


    Transcript here
    Spoiler:
    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
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    A (sub hunting/ ship radar extension) helicopter training supervisor has come forward after seeing The Nimitz documentary and gives his account on the mysterious events from Nov 2004.


    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
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    ^ An Air Force crew from the mainland helicoptered onto the Battlegroup support cruiser and borrowed their Sea Hawk to record the UFO (watched live by this petty officer via data link).

    The helicopter transponder was physically removed so the Princeton had to leave the training exercise and sail to harbour to receive a new one. This unprecedented departure took two days from the 'work up' to war in the gulf.

    This was obviously not planned.
    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
  • bad_hair_day
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    So the world has physical evidence of close encounters with multiple UFO's and no one gives a proper fuck is truly baffling to me.

    If half the claims in these events are accurate it's astounding what they engaged fifteen years ago.

    This reenactment / interviews with it's dramatic voice over and music shouldn't detract from the fact this actually happened and it's implications.



    Then there's the 2009 investigation and testimonies documented in this partially redacted US government (AATIP) report.

    Spoilered as 13 images.
    Spoiler:

    https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:TIC_TAC_UFO_EXECUTIVE_REPORT_1526682843046_42960218_ver1.0.pdf

    Why aren't these conclusions troubling to anyone else and changing world views?

    SMH 0_O <3


    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
  • It’s a big if. I’m no expert on declassified US military documents but do they usually feature statements like: ‘which was weird’, ‘it was unusual’, ‘I didn’t see that coming’ etc?

    Just feels like another con job, for what purpose I’ve no idea. But then I’m not very well read up on it to be honest.

    Just the fact the story involves someone from Blink-182 makes me hope it’s exposed as complete bollocks. It’s like the bassist from Sum 41 stumbling upon the Holy Grail or the Offspring curing cancer. These clowns shouldn’t be involved in anything of historical or international importance. Frankly I’ll be disappointed if this is the exception to that rule.
  • Yossarian
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    It’s not, don’t worry.
  • I guess I'll tell Green Day to keep the secret of alchemy to themselves, then.
  • Coldplay have worked out the secret behind clean, free energy. They posted it on a wordpress blog ages ago and it’s only now the mainstream media are trying to discredit it all.
  • No, you're thinking of Blur. Alex James figured it out when building his eco house and posted it to Myspace . Why do you think they did the redesign that lost everyone's content?

    Sadly he doesn't use the internet since completion of the house as it interferes with the cheesemaking process so no one will ever find out how to do it.
  • “We saw a thing and don’t know what it was!”
    Well, okay. So come back when you do know what it was?
  • Skerret
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    He uses a cheese-powered internet Dante
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • bad_hair_day
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    LarryDavid wrote:
    It’s a big if. I’m no expert on declassified US military documents but do they usually feature statements like: ‘which was weird’, ‘it was unusual’, ‘I didn’t see that coming’ etc?

    Larry, cheers for engaging but couldn't find those quotes anywhere in the report?

    LarryDavid wrote:
    Just feels like another con job, for what purpose I’ve no idea. But then I’m not very well read up on it to be honest.

    Just the fact the story involves someone from Blink-182 makes me hope it’s exposed as complete bollocks. It’s like the bassist from Sum 41 stumbling upon the Holy Grail or the Offspring curing cancer. These clowns shouldn’t be involved in anything of historical or international importance. Frankly I’ll be disappointed if this is the exception to that rule.

    Felt the same, but see it as someone with passion and the means to propel these events into public discourse. DeLonge has admitted he was initially out of his depth but has engaged and employed persons with more experience to compensate/educate.

    Point in case is the recent partnership with The US Army to analyse meta material TTSA claim to have.

    https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/research/a29504031/army-ufo-mysterious-technology/


    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
  • I exaggerated some of those responses for comic effect tbh.
  • A semantic point, perhaps, but the things you describe are not physical evidence, BHD. There is not physical evidence of what you describe.

    Regarding the video, too, you say that the absolutely laughable nature of it, “shouldn’t detract from the fact this actually happened.” Again, that can’t be stated as a certainty.

    Why aren’t these conclusions troubling to me? Because I don’t give them credit.
  • bad_hair_day
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    Isn't radar and video recording physical evidence as in CCTV and speed traps?

    The US government said it happened.
    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
  • Isn't radar and video recording physical evidence as in CCTV and speed traps?
    They may have different definitions, but no, those aren’t physical evidence. Those are readings of observed things. Physical evidence would be a piece of debris, or a sample of fuel emissions found in the water, for example.

    The US government said it happened.
    Okay.
  • bad_hair_day
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    Semantics indeed.
    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
  • It’s an important distinction, though. With physical evidence, there is no disputing the physicality of the thing, the subjectiveness comes from what aspects of it might point to.

    With readings of measurements etc, the actual accuracy absolutely can be disputed; with a lot of this equipment, false readings abound, whether through disruption prior to the signal reaching the device, or errors in recording or calculating that data.

    Take the description of the readings suggesting objects descended from space to see level rapidly. Could that be something causing the device to fire through its full range of potential variables? Does anything corroborate the conclusion they’ve drawn?

    Out of interest, if we were to pretend, for a moment, that the US Government is a reliable source, have they confirmed that several people definitely had a close encounter with a UFO, or have they just confirmed that these documents are the reports of what happened that day from the people who were there?
  • bad_hair_day
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    Andy wrote:
    It’s an important distinction, though. With physical evidence, there is no disputing the physicality of the thing, the subjectiveness comes from what aspects of it might point to.

    It's physical in the sense physical objects were tracked by multiple systems on ships, a radar plane, a hunter helicopter and four jets, now on a physical tapes hard drives and corroboration being servicemen who'd come forward likely risking ridicule. 

    Andy wrote:
    With readings of measurements etc, the actual accuracy absolutely can be disputed; with a lot of this equipment, false readings abound, whether through disruption prior to the signal reaching the device, or errors in recording or calculating that data. 

    Take the description of the readings suggesting objects descended from space to see level rapidly. Could that be something causing the device to fire through its full range of potential variables? Does anything corroborate the conclusion they’ve drawn?

    Radar chief Kevin Day had Gary Vorhees and his tech crew shut down the radar systems and ran a full diagnostic to make sure it wasn't a malfunction of some kind, only to find the signals clearer afterwards and were of 'weapons quality'.  

    It's pertinent to point out packs of 5-10 unknowns had been tracked days before jets engaged the closest of the group on Nov 14. During the encounter, the objects were also tracked by the crews of the Hawkeye plane and the Sea Hawk helicopter. 

    Andy wrote:
    Out of interest, if we were to pretend, for a moment, that the US Government is a reliable source, have they confirmed that several people definitely had a close encounter with a UFO, or have they just confirmed that these documents are the reports of what happened that day from the people who were there?

    This video of the UFO at their jets CAP point is official and approved for pubic release and supports the report.  




    Source https://thevault.tothestarsacademy.com/2004-nimitz-flir1-video


    .
    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
  • It's physical in the sense physical objects were tracked by multiple systems on ships, a radar plane, a hunter helicopter and four jets, now on a physical tapes hard drives and corroboration being servicemen who'd come forward likely risking ridicule.
    It is alleged that physical objects were tracked. Even if it were ever proven that all of this is true, that does not make the footage ‘physical evidence’. Evidence, yes. Documentary evidence. Video evidence. But not physical evidence. I’m not criticising you, but ‘physical evidence’ means something specific, and it’s misleading to say that it exists when it doesn’t.

    Radar chief Kevin Day had Gary Vorhees and his tech crew shut down the radar systems and ran a full diagnostic to make sure it wasn't a malfunction of some kind, only to find the signals clearer afterwards and were of 'weapons quality'.
    I’m pretty sure it has already been discussed before that there is a difference between a traceable malfunction, and the system not operating as the operators expect when receiving certain signals.

    It's pertinent to point out packs of 5-10 unknowns had been tracked days before jets engaged the closest of the group on Nov 14. During the encounter, the objects were also tracked by the crews of the Hawkeye plane and the Sea Hawk helicopter.
    It’s pertinent to point out that inexplicable signals were recorded days before. The video above indicated that the Hawkeye didn’t pick anything up.

    This video of the UFO at their CAP point is official and approved for pubic release and supports the report.
    That doesn’t really answer my question.
  • When a load of data (evidence, reports etc) are dumped it does appear that something is amiss but what's important is to break down all those aspects individually and not much of it holds water.

    So take the fact they recorded something they couldn't explain. They ran diagnostics and couldn't find any faults.
    However later in that video they claim some people came to collect the data. They say this happened but this time was unusual because it was rushed and the blokes werent wearing the usual get up.
    Read between the lines and it was normal for them to not be able to diagnose faults in their equipment 100% of the time and it was routine enough for them to fall back on the manufacturer enough that they knew what uniform the people collecting the data would wear.

    Suddenly that whole area becomes a faulty piece of machinery and a casual Friday.

    Why was the data collected in a hurried manner that didnt fully follow procedure?
    Well could be aliens sure. Could be that there are huge concerns that machinery is recording data that the user can't read and can't diagnose as a fault. Basically, could the enemy have something we don't recognise or is the doohickey on the fritz?
    This could be led by further intelligence outside the need to know knowledge of everyone aboard that ship.

    Go again for why people risk ridicule.
    1. Money, they won't be rich men given their careers. Comfortable maybe, not rich.

    2. Recognition.
    They have been a very small cog, barely a washer, barely the lubricant on a washer in a machine their whole career with little to show for it.
    Never created anything, many never saw combat.
    A life dedicated to the military with barely a war story between them. Of course that wont be true for all of them but of the two videos I watched their jobs sounded incredibly dull.

    3. Loneliness
    Ties into recognition a bit but these blokes spent years at sea. As part of the system they had a purpose, friends and crew mates who were as family to them.
    Coming out of the military can be an incredibly lonely existence. This alien thing makes them part of something again.

    Could be none of the above, could be aliens.
  • “Sorry lads, War’s off...”

    “Again? Fuck this, I’m inventing an alien contact or summat”
  • LarryDavid wrote:
    “Sorry lads, War’s off...”

    “Again? Fuck this, I’m inventing an alien contact or summat”
    I will remind you they are Americans.
  • I wasn’t doubting your reasoning. I’ve no idea what happened really.

    I’m just in a silly mood.
  • Watching Hair's videos will put an end to that.

    I watched the first two 30 minute videos posted, 2 minutes of alien guff, 28 minutes of intricate explanation of paperwork.
  • bad_hair_day
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    Andy, the Hawkeye had a hard time locking the object so The Princeton used their radar and coordinating of Cmr Fravor's jets to the closest unknown.

    Look, there's multiple testimony from the crews and video evidence and is not the only weird incident in recent history, just focusing on this one because it's bloody interesting.

    I'm guessing the DOD didn't want the report (if genuine) released but stuff leaks. Can't find a web page saying 'Our boys and girls had a close encounter' but wouldn't expect them to. They have definitively said they don't know what these things are

    From The Washington Post:

    “The Navy designates the objects contained in these videos as unidentified aerial phenomena,” said Joseph Gradisher, official spokesperson for the Deputy Chief of Naval Operations for Information Warfare. 

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2019/09/18/those-ufo-videos-are-real-navy-says-please-stop-saying-ufo/



    Here's the paper trail.  Looks legit?

    https://www.theblackvault.com/casefiles/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/18-F-0644.pdf
    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.

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