Mass Effect Universe (Spoilers)
  • Little Franklin
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    @monkey How much do you want to be shown? I want to know what happens to the Reapers, but beyond that I'm happy for them to leave things open ended.
  • Bollockoff
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    I'd rather pledge currency to a really big multiplayer DLC pack.
  • Little Franklin
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    Not bothered with the multiplayer. For me Mass Effect has always been about the story, the combat gameplay isn't enough fun for me to want to play it over a game built specifically for multiplayer.
  • Bollockoff
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    Did you try the MP? It's bloody good fun. Surprisingly so.
  • It's good fun. A little limited though. After Uncharted and to an extent Red Dead Redemption, I kind of need my multiplayer to have a bit of a story to it. I know it ties into the Single Player assets and that, but a little form would have been appreciated.
    I'm a Sasquatch man and I'm watching you.
  • Little Franklin
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    Did lose a couple of afternoons to it, but it felt like a bit of a one trick pony. And like I say, there are just more satisfying games out there.
  • Little Franklin
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    Tempy wrote:
    I still don't think they should change it though and I think it works ok at a casual glance. I was left unsatisfied, but not to the point where i'd plage even a dollar to get it changed. They did so much write that I can ignore the cock up at the end, it does ruin the game for me.
    What about people who haven't played it yet? Won't it be good to give them a better ending? It's not like we have to pay for it.
  • @monkey How much do you want to be shown?

    Not sure. I don't really have an answer to that. There's plenty of room for leaving things open, or ambiguous in general. But I do think that for an epic, sprawling trilogy then the short, sharp ambiguous ending is a mistake, even if they had pulled it off better. 

    In respect of showing the fate of the galaxy then they just needed a little chunk, maybe about 4 seconds. Some clip of the fleet sat there at the end in a 'What's next for them?' moment, or alternatively it getting ripped up by the blast. Or some Krogan getting incinerated by the blast with a lower form of life coming to chew on its corpse or something. Just something that shows you what the final state is. 

    Now if there's a reason for leaving that out, then fine. If there's some higher narrative they're trying to stick to, then ok. But there really isn't. It just seems like an oversight.
  • The ending is neither short, nor sharp, that scene goes on for at least 15 minutes. It is simply not the ending the fans wanted/expected.

    I believe that the clips of the galaxy in it's various forms after you make the choice are still just visions in Shepherd's mind. When he breathes again after the credits at the end, he's lying on the pile of concrete by the beam, not up in the crucible. To me this implies he hasn't even set foot on the crucible, he simply comes round back on earth having survived the indoctrination attempt. 

    Maybe it was Bioware's intention that this is somehow symbolic to the player that having survived the Reaper's final attempt to stop him, Shepherd goes on to use the crucible and save the galaxy - a.k.a the bit everyone expected to see. 

    Maybe that will be what the DLC shows. Maybe that bit will be paid for DLC later, who knows.
    Don't try and place me in a box, you cocks. If there's one thing I'm not, it's fucking tory scum.
  • Roujin wrote:
    The ending is neither short, nor sharp, that scene goes on for at least 15 minutes.
    That depends on where you're saying it starts. 


    It's short in content at any rate. Stuff blows up. Normandy crashes. The End. Epilogue: Buzz Aldrin is boring.
  • I'm saying the game ends when you get hit by the reaper beam.

    There's no more fighting, no more playing, just you and a fuckton of dialogue to get through before you get a cutscene about space magic.

    EDIT: Damn you page turn!
    Don't try and place me in a box, you cocks. If there's one thing I'm not, it's fucking tory scum.
  • Dear God, just in case a 20 minute video in the Indoctrination Theory wasn't enough, I give you a 90 minute video on the Indoc. Theory!



    Dude really goes into every little detail put forward so far and goes them all reasonably objectively. Worth a watch if you're interested.
    Don't try and place me in a box, you cocks. If there's one thing I'm not, it's fucking tory scum.
  • He can see remodelling the inside.
    I'm a Sasquatch man and I'm watching you.
  • Skimmed through that video. I can't watch the whole thing.

    Never heard that thing about the indoctrinated eyes before (Picks up around 1:06:00). Pretty compelling evidence, although I don't personally need any more convincing. 


    Its an absolute tragedy that they botched the final execution because its genius, frankly.
  • Little Franklin
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    Skipped to some bit in the middle of the video and the guy was saying synthesis was the wrong choice because Legion doesn't have a soul . . . kind of put me off watching the rest of it.
  • Yeah I heard that bit. It was weak.

    Skip to the eyes! 1:06:00
  • Skipped to some bit in the middle of the video and the guy was saying synthesis was the wrong choice because Legion doesn't have a soul . . . kind of put me off watching the rest of it.
    This. Some of this stuff really misses a whole lot of the point of the What Is Life question and who is qualified to make the decision on who lives and dies work that so much of Mass Effect has been about.
    I'm a Sasquatch man and I'm watching you.
  • Little Franklin
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    It's interesting but I'm not completely convinced by the eye thing. Saren's eyes didn't look the same as TIM's and looking at some ME2 screen shots TIM had the synthetic eyes in that, and he didn't do anything to indicate he was indoctrinated then, quite the opposite. I think they just used the effect on Shep to indicate his conscience/DNA was being absorbed, and don't forget Shepherd has synthetic eyes with the three points as well, they usually glow red if you play as a renegade.

    Does this mean if they'd stuck with the indoctrination ending you would only be allowed to see what really happens if you chose the 'destroy' ending? That would suck ass.
  • Bollockoff
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    I ended up choosing the Reaper's destruction come endgame. It made it a fairly painful thing to do knowing that i'd be wiping out the Geth. Who I became quite fond of. More so than the Quarians.
  • Franklin TIM wanted you to recover a reaper for him. He also specifically threw all Cerberus's resources behind bringing back Shepherd - a prime target for indoctrination. He also reveres the reapers in terms if what control would bring.

    His actions regarding shepherd are exactly the things someone indoctrinated would do. Same goes for his attitude towards control.

    Indoctrination is subtle. Think back across everything the illusive man does, he is convinced he can control Reaper influence or merge with their technology. The exact same thing Saren rambled on about for the entire first game.

    The long video is worth a watch if you get the chance. Whoever flipped out about legion not having a soul, the author goes on to quantify his statement to prevent precisely the reaction you had because you are ghey for Legion/the Geth in general.
    Don't try and place me in a box, you cocks. If there's one thing I'm not, it's fucking tory scum.
  • It's interesting but I'm not completely convinced by the eye thing. Saren's eyes didn't look the same as TIM's and looking at some ME2 screen shots TIM had the synthetic eyes in that, and he didn't do anything to indicate he was indoctrinated then, quite the opposite.
    I just thought the glowing blue eyes that all three have was the indicator rather than the specific pattern. Don't get me wrong, there's plenty in that video and others of its ilk that is tosh. Just people picking up bugs, or asset re-use or lazy coding or coincidence,  that would otherwise go unnoticed, and proclaiming it as circumstantial evidence of some grand plan. 

    And the 'Geth have no souls' thing, the guy is just wrong about. He ignores a lot of the game's plot in order to make that arbitrary point. It's a shame (but probably inevitable) that most of the stuff has been compiled by idiots who have over thought the whole thing. There's a handful of very compelling ideas, a lot of circumstantial evidence and a load of bullshit, generally all mixed together in the same articles and videos.
  • EvilRedEye
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    IIRC the Illusive Man first comes into contact with Reaper tech in the novel set between ME2 and ME3. He fucking screams 'indoctrination' in ME3 but I'm not sure it'd be possible for him to be indoctrinated as far back as ME2.
    "ERE's like Mr. Muscle, he loves the things he hates"
  • (And he probably saved the Galaxy indirectly by rebuilding Shepherd.)
    I'm a Sasquatch man and I'm watching you.
  • Roujin wrote:
    you are ghey for Legion/the Geth in general
    There's an in-game distinction between AI and VI that this guy seems to miss. 
    Plus the Geth and EDI self-actualisation strands. But the face-value ending completely ignores all that too so its understandable.
  • EvilRedEye
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    Oh, I think I was just talking bollocks. I'm checking the prequel graphic novel and the Illusive Man's eyes randomly change from brown to blue after sitting in a temple containing a Reaper artefact for a few days. This is way pre-ME1.
    "ERE's like Mr. Muscle, he loves the things he hates"
  • Are the graphic novels / comics any good?
  • EvilRedEye
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    Talking balls again, did another check - the Illusive Man gets zapped by a Reaper artefact wayyy before ME1, later in the story he's kept in a temple with the artefact and his eyes are permanently blue after that.
    "ERE's like Mr. Muscle, he loves the things he hates"
  • EvilRedEye
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    monkey wrote:
    Are the graphic novels / comics any good?

    I'd say the first one is essential reading before playing the Shadowbroker DLC in ME2. The second one is OK, as the backstory for the Illusive Man it's got that annoying "they all knew each other at school" vibe to it, where he bumps into stuff like Reaper tech surprisingly early in the timeline.
    "ERE's like Mr. Muscle, he loves the things he hates"
  • Little Franklin
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    There's a pretty good one that shows how Aria was driven off Omega. None of them are that well written though.
    Bollockoff wrote:
    I ended up choosing the Reaper's destruction come endgame. It made it a fairly painful thing to do knowing that i'd be wiping out the Geth. Who I became quite fond of. More so than the Quarians.
    Yeah me too. Bit weird considering I spent the whole first game killing them. I guess they've got a kind of dumb innocence to them, and the historical clips show them as faithful, mistreated pets to the Quarians.
    But y'know, my Shep was a bitch so she was like "Fuck all them robots, I only care about my hot lesbian GF."
  • Bollockoff
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    But y'know, my Shep was a bitch so she was like "Fuck all them robots, I only care about my hot lesbian GF."

    You can go lesbo with Tali? Really now?

    And I suspect the only real reason I like Geth is because their mono-lamps remind me of the Pixar mascot. If the Geth actually hopped around like one I think everyone would love em' too.

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