It's an ending that hammers home the "BAD CHOICES" Ellie makes but leaves it open for her "JOURNEY TO REDEMPTION" in the final instalment of the trilogy because no-one can ever just make one of anything ever more.

Yeah, there’s more to Abby’s side now. I’ve had enough of Ellie. 

With no Ellie and no reminder of Abby killing Joel, I’d be happy to play as her for a game finding Firelies in the island or wherever.

But change it up a bit on gameplay again please.

It’ll be about Ellie tracking down the fireflys, to give herself and special non zombie brain to them so her life MEANS SOMETHING!!! But then the child she briefly raised with Dina(who actually has little to do with Ellie since he/she found out Ellie abandoned her to go on a futile revenge mission) will come and save her but it’ll be too late so now there’ll be another revenge mission but we’ll realise that violence begets violence and that this will never ever end and now we have been taught lessons. Then Sue Ellen will wake up and JR will be in the shower and it was all just a dream, phew.

A follow up to the video syph posted. The more I think about this game the more I appreciate it. It's probably my favourite of this gen, certainly in my top 5.

Yep watched this the other day great review

Oh hang on it’s not the review. More stuff yeah!

That was good.

Just read that. Good piece. 

Didn’t really make the full connection, although I was aware Druckmann is Israeli, but I didn’t like the depiction of the Scars. Some of the comments the characters and notes make. Maybe because I’m religious / a Muslim?

I mean very early on, I didn’t like that you see Christian and Jewish gravestones but no obvious Muslim ones. You have characters from different backgrounds, but no Arab/Indian or Muslim ones - not that I could see, but again could be me seeing things or reading into it.

Maybe deliberate on Druckmann’s part, despite what he may say about taking a centrist approach?

Yeah, I just didn't get the opportunity to write anything mroe substantial in the end. With this, I think it's supposed to be an even-handed approach to Israel-Palestine, but it fails badly and the best it can do is say, hey, violence is bad on both sides. Its attempt at an ultra-PC approach to relligion is embarrassingly clumsly - the scars' religion isn't bad as such, but its been corrupted by the current leaders (Hamas!) to turn it into a violent sect. And while most its members are brainwashed terrorists, lets not forget that a few of them are still human.

I’m assuming if it was a KF podcast that the host was Greg Miller? I like him as a daily host but he’s too in love with himself to ever let anything deep get in the way of Greg Miller take.

Minnesänger wrote:

I’m assuming if it was a KF podcast that the host was Greg Miller? I like him as a daily host but he’s too in love with himself to ever let anything deep get in the way of Greg Miller take.

Sounds about right 

Still need to catch up on the thread. But where can I get a link to Jon's review?

Still so much to think about and chew through. Gameplay wise it started to feel very uncharted at points (bit where Abby leaving the stadium and getting ambushed for example) but some unreal stealth moments. Overall I found the gameplay quite enjoyable and much improved.

I played TLOU for the first time in its remastered form on ps4 couple years back only. As a gamer dad it hit me hard. Loved Joel and Ellie. And I ran into that operating room with the same intentions as Joel.

So the killing of Joel. Fuck me that was horrific. Physical pain aside, for him to see that these people have Ellie and she is seeing him like that. Just so sad.

I was totally on board for some rough revenge. I still hate they killed Joel tbh.

Playing for so much of the game as Abby was strange. I never warmed to her. Ever. She was totally willing to kill Dinah knowing she was pregnant. I hate saying this but Abby needed more game time. There were hints she regretted what she did to Joel. Exploring that might have helped me warm to her. She seemed a vicious killer in a way Ellie was not. Yes Ellie killed many,many people in her quest for revenge but it took its toll on her. She didn't enjoy it or take it in her stride.
The only aspects of Abby I liked were her companions. Gutted that Yara died but delighted Lev lived.
Owen in particular seemed a like a pretty alright dude. Again real pity he died.
Actually there was one point I felt sorry for Abby. It was Ellie reading the letter on the boat that Abby wrote to Owen. That gave me a little pause.

But I hated the fight in the theatre. I let Ellie kill Abby a few times. She deserved it.

Regarding the woke stuff,I didn't really care or notice much. Just people being people.

Ellie seems to be drawing some hate, but had Abby not tortured Joel like she did then Ellie may not have had quite the epic reaction. Also Ellie was willing and planning to stop her chase when she and Dinah met up with Jesse and Tommy.

phone acting up will post more when on pc

Thanks!

Really enjoyed that review and agree with the vast majority. Bravo sir.


So I've had a little time to think. For me, the story of Part 2 lands in a lot of ways. But not in one particular aspect. And its arguably a pivotal point of the game.
My problem is Abby. What she did to Joel just went too far to forgive or at least (as Ellie) understand the motivations behind it and move on. Also throughout the game Abby makes plenty of comments that she is perfectly ok with this sort of violence and was enthused about cutting the throat of a pregnant woman(knowing she was pregnant).
I think ND missed the mark with her. Playing as Abby, it was her companions that were humanised, not her. Owen, Manny, Norah come out of it really well. I hate that they were all killed. But Abby.....nope she went too far and it was pretty clear he was not averse to that sort of violence. 
So no I couldnt get on board the Abby train at all. Seeing her on the pillar at the end I was pretty ok with that. 
The only redeeming factor about Abby was again not from her, but Yara and Lev. I didnt want Ellie to kill Abby at the end simply because I wanted someone left to take care of Lev.  

Had Abby just executed Joel without the fanfare then I could absolutely see myself being more on her side and even empathising with her. But had she made a clean kill I don't think Ellie would have been so propelled, desperate for vengeance. 
That for me is why TLOU1 worked better. By the end of the game I was fully on board with Joel taking the selfish route and saving Ellie.

Seemed like a bad product, I have avoided it.

Meh.

All fair points ninja, the Abby thing has been such a talking point. I warmed to her personally and I like the fact you got to play as her. There are pacing issues, I think abbies plot was particularly weak to begin with. I loved the lev parts but I'd of liked her story to have been more involved with the main story from the beginning (prologue aside). Maybe do a day as Ellie then a day as Abby might of helped the pacing as well, I don't know.

I can honestly say no game has made me hunt out info and opinions quite like this game. It's easily my game of the generation and a 10/10.

I want factions now and I want TLOU 3 on ps5 to finish it all off.

Ha ha