2023 - the worst year in gaming yet? (and it's only May!)
  • A nice big list of stuff using UE5.
    The TBA release date games seem to be more the kind that will really utilise it more so we might be a couple of years off yet.
    https://gamerant.com/all-confirmed-unreal-engine-5-games/
  • davyK
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    Surely there really has to be a time when the investment in a AAA title plateaus?

    The risk associated with investments means that new IP becomes increasingly rare. And the dev time to market put against the shelf life of a AAA game is terrifying.

    With stale IP risking apathy and the risk of something not selling within a small window - it just doesn't look sustainable in the longer term.

    I'm amazed it works at all to be honest.
    Holding the wrong end of the stick since 2009.
  • EvilRedEye
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    LivDiv wrote:
    EvilRedEye wrote:
    I was quite surprised when Digital Foundry said Jedi Survivor had been done on Unreal 4. I guess it just slightly missed the boat on 5? But I wonder if the performance would have been any different if it had been developed for 5.

    So was I, literally just looked it up.
    Unreal 5 only launched a year ago for production use so probably just too late to really benefit. If there is a third which seems likely I would have thought it would use Unreal 5.

    The next installment of the Final Fantasy VII remake is meant to be using 5 and releases at the end of the calendar year I think, which is why I was surprised. I guess it must just have been unfortunate timing for Jedi. To be fair, it's a decent release window given Zelda is about conquer everyone's attention for months so I could see why they wouldn't want to wait.
    "ERE's like Mr. Muscle, he loves the things he hates"
  • @davy
    I think there is still a good amount of scope in spec.
    8k 120fps could potentially be a target at some point. Beyond that I think we are getting outside of what the eye can see.
    Then you have the quality of art assets, until it matches movies there is still scope to improve.

    There is still huge audience expansion possible. There's a backfill of gamers coming through as us older lot carry on playing.
    Then there are countries like China that have exploded as an audience, India will be there too. The difference there is that tatses tend to be a bit different (with crossover obviously).
    Gaming is still a huge growth market even if some genres or titles are becoming saturated.

    I dont think its just a case of more people and more time and more money though. It has to come from more intelligent development approaches. AI will probably play a part.
  • Don't think Davy means the quality that can be reached- more the cost associated to get there. I was wondering the same thing. Huge investment paid doesn't equate to return on investment received (in any business) and these games are costing big money to make. Obviously if you have a key brand it helps. Something brand new? Don't know about that

    But maybe that's where all the paid for dlc has to come in.
    SFV - reddave360
  • Zelda, Baldurs Gate, and Diablo IV all come out this year so it's gonna be a good year for me.

    And I think the Jedi game will probably be fine by the time I get round to it.
  • Sorry I think I half answered but didnt get that across well.

    So something like a Star Wars game would fall into that growing age group audience. Star Wars has appeal across generations so as long as Disney can attract young fans that Star Wars audience grows for games too until children of the 1970s/80s start to die off, then it probably saturates. So there are still likely more and more people wanting a Star Wars game into the future so budgets can go up for a while yet with an expectation on similar percentage returns. However Star Wars as far as I am aware has less fandom outside of the West so probably wont be able to expand that way.

    Other IP could be inverse of that and go for breadth across audiences rather than expanding the core by age. Armoured Core 6 for example is going to be the latest in quite an old series but has been getting buzz because From have built a fanbase through Souls. Im going to take a punt it will make the most money out of the whole series so far on pre-orders alone. The result could be Armoured Core 7 has a bigger budget.

    I think most IP will have space to expand into, that increases sales and allows for more budget. That naturally ends at some point as total money spent by humans is maximised. Although that doesnt necessarily stop budgets going up still. Movie budgets are still going up and up, this seems to be at the expense of smaller productions that get muscled out of multi-plexes.
  • EvilRedEye
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    Re: reducing investment in one game, I feel like a game that used to be 10-15 hours in the PS3 era will now be 20-25 hours to justify the £70 price tag. I guess the economics of it might be difficult for your standard £70 boxed product but I'd be happy for cheaper games with less content, particularly on Xbox where value is more about having stuff on the Game Pass release calendar than hours per pound.
    "ERE's like Mr. Muscle, he loves the things he hates"
  • regmcfly
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    I saw a starfield lucozade advert on a bus today so it better come
  • I can't distinguish between game years because I only play the same ones as they update now.
  • davyK
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    RedDave2 wrote:
    Don't think Davy means the quality that can be reached- more the cost associated to get there. I was wondering the same thing. Huge investment paid doesn't equate to return on investment received (in any business) and these games are costing big money to make. Obviously if you have a key brand it helps. Something brand new? Don't know about that But maybe that's where all the paid for dlc has to come in.

    Yeah - that's what I was getting at.  It all feels a bit overblown.
    Holding the wrong end of the stick since 2009.
  • davyK
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    Brooks wrote:
    I can't distinguish between game years because I only play the same ones as they update now.

    I would say many a person does this.
    Holding the wrong end of the stick since 2009.
  • bad_hair_day
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    Hello sailors.
    retroking1981: Fuck this place I'm off to the pub.
  • davyK
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    'tis the lesser of two weevils.
    Holding the wrong end of the stick since 2009.
  • Dredge is great. Feel like when that hits a sub service it might end up being a bit of a forum fave.
  • Kow
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    I have my eye on Dredge. I'm fairly fed up of the triple As. I think part of the reason I just couldn't be arsed with a ps5 is their focus seems to be on these huge dull AAA titles. God of Bore, Last of Us, Horizon, Uncharted. Shiny borefests the lot of them. Steam Deck is where the good stuff is.
  • b0r1s
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    Dredge is on my wish list
  • Dredge is on my shelf ! Waiting for the perfect opportunity
    The Forum Herald™
  • Oh yeah, big shout out to Hi Fi Rush btw. Nailed it.
  • Kow wrote:
    Steam Deck is where the good stuff is.

    There isn't a day that goes by now when I wish I would have invested in one of those devices. Stuff like Project Zomboid (that's never going to get a console release probably) - playing that on Valve's handheld must be a giddy experience.
    It wasn't until I hit my thirties that I realised you could unlock rewards by exploring the map
  • FranticPea
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    I play it on my kishi via Geforce Now. Its a great handheld game.
  • When did AAA become a term?

    I honestly don't remember it being a thing in the 90s.

    Fucking horrible term, like games have divisions/grades for quality.

    Probably started when E3 became a big thing, thank fuck that's dying a death. Hated the way that evolved into the be all and end all of gaming related announcements, much like how a game has to be AAA to be worthy.

    Fuck all that shite.
    オレノナハ エラー ダ
  • Which game was AAAA (quad A)?

    It was some flop right?
  • I always took it that AAA just meant big budget (and probably big publisher) and had no reflection on the quality.
    SFV - reddave360
  • @LivDiv - it was Callisto Protocol, no?
  • Yeah that was it.
    Fucking Quad A. What a dickhead.
  • regmcfly
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    LivDiv wrote:
    Yeah that was it.
    Fucking Quad A. What a dickhead.

    No, it wasn't. It was whatever the Coalition's first Gears was, as they were set up as a "quad A" studio.
  • regmcfly wrote:
    LivDiv wrote:
    Yeah that was it. Fucking Quad A. What a dickhead.
    No, it wasn't. It was whatever the Coalition's first Gears was, as they were set up as a "quad A" studio.

    Page 14 of Krafton's investor relations presentation - they position Callisto as AAAA:

    https://www.krafton.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/KRAFTON_1Q22_Investor-Relations_ENG_vSend.pdf

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