Someone's just pointed out to us that it meets the Scottish legal definition of fraud:

There is no succinct definition to embrace all the criminal forms of cheating. However, if the following three elements are present in a cheat the crime of fraud is complete.

Falsehood - False representations by words, or writing or conduct.

Fraud - Intention to deceive or defraud

Wilful Imposition - The cheat designed has been successful to extent of gaining benefit or advantage, or of prejudicing or tending to prejudice the interests of another person.

All three of these parts must be proven in order to prove that fraud has occurred.

We have falsehood from the initial agreement to pay the full price, fraud from the fact she doesn't intend to pay the full price, and wilful imposition in that she's gained the benefit of a cheap horse.

But you've also gained the (minor) benefit of part payment. It will be a long slog to go that route and there's no guarantee of success (only a guarantee of a lot of time, money, energy expenditure).

Elmlea wrote:

Another thing; my wife's tempted to contact people who know this woman and explain what she's done.  Is she opening herself up to any issues there...?

I'd definitely avoid doing that. There possibly won't be legal ramifications, but it won't look good for you if it looks like it's getting personal for your side or if you've done anything that could be construed as vindictive or spiteful.

I think a letter stating our claim is best, with 10 days to pay up or give the pony back. We're going to call the police anyway as it's fraud rather than theft we'd be looking at as per the definition I posted, and it can't hurt. The British Horse Society have a legal advice line so we'll see what they say too.

Elmlea wrote:

The British Horse Society have a legal advice line

There's a what that has a what?

Elmlea wrote:

metagonzo wrote:

Are they likely to release it to someone who doesn't pay the bills for its accommodation?

In what sense?  We could pitch up with a trailer and take him away, it just depends on whether or not the livery yard would feel comfortable with that.

That's pretty much what I meant. I hope it works out; sounds like a rough deal.

Result.

throughout I was wondering how they would afford the upkeep as horses are generally fucking expensive to maintain.

mk64 wrote:

throughout I was wondering how they would afford the upkeep as horses are generally fucking expensive to maintain.

Depends if you're riding it or eating it.

That's unreal.  I'd love to know how they (the Police) got away with that.

How much does it cost to keep a horse for, say, 1 month?

Liveinadive wrote:

I would have thought the vet bills would be high?

Nah. Just buy a shotgun and make a quick call to a glue factory.

tigerswiftly wrote:

How much does it cost to keep a horse for, say, 1 month?

Depends on the horse and the location, before other factors.  In terms of livery costs, basic grass livery (i.e. access to a field space for the horse only, no stable) can be as cheap as £10 a week.  You go through levels after that, a stable might be £20, that's if you're still on what they call DIY livery where you look after your horse entirely on your own.

After that you can get part livery, where the yard might turn your horse out from his stable for you in the morning but expect you to pitch up to check him out and put him away at the end of the day.  Part livery varies massively because it depends on whether you want the yard to do turnout, rugging, feeding, mucking out, making beds, etc.  You can pay about £30 a week for part livery in some places.

Full livery is where they do all the extra stuff, and you just pitch up and ride.  That'll probably cost you in the region of £200-300 a month, depending on the location.

Above that level you're into the realms of training livery and things like that, where they look after your horse and put him on a training schedule too, so your time with him's restricted but he gets trained.  That can be very expensive.

If it's an incredibly racehorse or eventer, then costs are magnified.  If it's a "happy hacker" that you just use for riding for fun and no competition, chances are it'll be cheaper.  If you find a livery yard in the home counties, it'll cost more than one in rural Yorkshire, and so on and so forth.

Basically anything from £10-100 a week; although the upper end means you don't have to buy your own hay, food, bedding etc.

Fuck, that's cheaper than a cat!
Other than the insurance.

I guess saddles etc are a pricey one off purchase no?


If horses are so cheap to raise why aren't we eating them (and knowing about it)?

That is cheaper than I thought.

Let's buy a horse together, Live.