Retro Club - 8 & 16-bit puzzlers - The Bear and Badger

Moot_Geeza

It took me ages to buy the Mega Drive collection but it's been well worth the money. There's stuff missing, 'cos that's how it goes these days, but it's a great package.

davyK

Gunstar Heroes felt too chaotic for me. I didn't click with it. But it's a gorgeous game and the variety in the levels is incredible. I've always intended to go back and see if my opinion has changed.

Moot_Geeza

There's a lot to it in terms of moveset, especially for a game that came out of nowhere. Probably part of the reason why it's so highly regarded. Jump kicks, slides, a shoulder barge, wall jumps, throws, even a block move. It's a bit overwhelming at first as it's easy to get destroyed despite the seemingly generous health bar and there's a lot going on most of the time.

The minecart stage screams peak 16-bit louder than most other things. I borrowed it as a kid (and liked it) and I've played it at least once since, but last night was probably the most I've ever enjoyed it. 6/10 my arse...

Eric

Nice Moot,
Homing with Force combo is my go to but the laser fire (lightsabre) is good fun.

There's actually loads of depth to the melee with separate moves tied to fixed or free shot. I only realised there was a block function on a replay a couple of years back which was a bit embarrassing. (Edit;what Moot said!)

It is definitely chaotic though, it's certainly not as refined as Contra, and I'm guessing it would be impossible to do a no damage run (goes off to check) .

It's still a marvel to me that they got it to work on the MD hardware especially given its relatively earlyish release date (93).

Eric

Gulp... Absolutely nuts but some insightful takes in here...

Moot_Geeza

Yeah it definitely feels like a 'you will get hit' type of game, but not in a bad way 'cos it's not a one hit kills deal. That sort of thing can feel awful (Earthworm Jim!), but it doesn't here. The health picks are enough to get decent players back up to high HP.

Moot_Geeza

There's always a dubs.

monkey

It's been a long time but isn't it that any homing weapon combo makes it completely doable. Then with anything else it gets pretty tough.

monkey

Moot_Geeza wrote:

There's a lot to it in terms of moveset, especially for a game that came out of nowhere. Probably part of the reason why it's so highly regarded. Jump kicks, slides, a shoulder barge, wall jumps, throws, even a block move. It's a bit overwhelming at first as it's easy to get destroyed despite the seemingly generous health bar and there's a lot going on most of the time. The minecart stage screams peak 16-bit louder than most other things. I borrowed it as a kid (and liked it) and I've played it at least once since, but last night was probably the most I've ever enjoyed it. 6/10 my arse...

That's what made it stand out so much I think. Felt like a real evolution compared to eg Contra.

Moot_Geeza wrote:

There are better 16-bit run & guns imo, but not many.

Which ones?

Blue Swirl

davyK wrote:

Gunstar Heroes felt too chaotic for me.

Gunstar Heroes, like all Treasure games, kicked the shit out of me. I'm still yet to make a dent in Radiant Silvergun.

Moot_Geeza

On MD I'd say the import version of Probotector (forget the OG Contra title - Alien something prob). Rocket Knight Adventures. I think I prefer Ghouls 'n Ghosts too, but wouldn't call that a better game necessarily. Will try to think of more but probably can't!

Moot_Geeza

Just tried Vectorman, which was a late MD release I never played in cart form. It fucking stinks. Such a weird time for game reviews - it appears to have been well received due to a visual style somewhere between Donkey Kong Country and Ballz, which is technically impressive (I guess), but it plays like shit. Will have to have another session later as I don't remember it being anywhere near this bad last time I tried it.

monkey

I tried that recently. Turned it off before the end of the first level. I think I rented it at the time and remember it being pretty good.

nick_md

monkey wrote:

Moot_Geeza wrote:

There are better 16-bit run & guns imo, but not many.

Which ones?

Earthworm Jim

monkey

Don't you dare.

retroking1981

Moot_Geeza wrote:

Just tried Vectorman, which was a late MD release I never played in cart form. It fucking stinks. Such a weird time for game reviews - it appears to have been well received due to a visual style somewhere between Donkey Kong Country and Ballz, which is technically impressive (I guess), but it plays like shit. Will have to have another session later as I don't remember it being anywhere near this bad last time I tried it.

Agreed. Pish.

davyK

I have the Vectorman cart. I quite like it but then I've never played it beyond level 1.....It's very cookie cutter but I like the presentation. Quite liked Cool Spot (SNES version) which just about fits the genre too.

re Gunstar Heroes - it was that " you are going to get hit" thing I didn't like. Being an old 1-hit-kill shmup head is probably why I didn't like that aspect of it. But I appreciated the power up system and the range of moves. That rail section was bonkers fun as far as I remember too - but I just couldn't stick with it.

Contra Rebirth on WiiWare is superb.

retroking1981

I've never clicked with Gunstar Heroes despite its obvious quality. As good as they are I just don't seem to get on with Treasure games.

I like a couple, Sin & Punishment on Wii springs to mind but overall there's something about them that I don't get on with and I'm not sure why.

I'll try and play Gunstar Heroes at some point this week, I also have Hard Corps Uprising that I've never given a fair shot to play to.

davyK

My Treasure favourite by far is Bangai O. Bonkers but it's a essentially a twin stick shmup. Gradius V is a great job too and they did a Wario game for Gamecube that was enjoyable - was a kind of a run-about-and-beat things up affair - haven't played it in ages - but it was a typically slick Treasure game.

Moot_Geeza

Bangai-O is probably my favourite too. Never played the N64 version though.

Moot_Geeza

Astro Boy would push it close maybe. Haven't played it for ages but I used to love it. Sin & Punishment 2 is amazing too, Dynamite Headdy will always be up there even if I suck at it these days.

davyK

N64 version is solid. Plays just as well as the DC version though the backgrounds aren't as pretty. The weapons system is different too - worth a play if you can get it. I sold 3 N64 PAL games CIB to fund it.

Moot_Geeza

retroking1981 wrote:

I also have Hard Corps Uprising that I've never given a fair shot to play to.

Do it. We got to stage 2 a few years back iirc, which felt like a sudden difficulty spike. I played it in sp last year and pushed through the baptism of fire. It's actually brilliant, and you wouldn't be utterly insane to consider it the best example of the genre ever.

It isn't though, because Valfaris is.

afgavinstan

Top 3 Treasure

1. Ikaruga
2. S&P 2
3. Dynamite Headdy

Thank you.

Blue Swirl

Moot_Geeza wrote:

Astro Boy would push it close maybe.

Astro Boy on the GBA?

Moot_Geeza

Yep, triffic game.

Blue Swirl

Stellar title. Phenomenal.

Moot_Geeza

ESWAT is shocking these days too. Got to the third boss and I'm done, awful controls.

retroking1981

Agreed. Pish.

retroking1981

Started Hard Corps Uprising. At first it feels a bit off for a Contra game, the pace is a lot slower and I'm not a fan of the art style but it is very good.

Playing in co-op for an hour or so a week so it'll be slow going.

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