MaM spoilerific thread of massive spoilers in the study with the candlestick - The Bear and Badger

mannaboy

Watched this over two days, half way through I started to think it wasn't a real doc, I just couldn't believe how incompetent the cops were, by design or accident, and the appalling treatment of Steven's nephew. But you couldn't make this shit up.

You hear of cases being thrown out due to technicalities, this case had so many issues I'm surprised it didn't fall into that category.

Whether Steve did the crime or not, and I'm not 100% sure either way, the detectives botched the investigation and he should be released.

Yossarian

Finally watched this, compelling stuff.

I think he's innocent, too much stuff doesn't add up, not least the lack of a crime scene (the lack of forensic evidence besides what could easily have been planted in the house or garage makes this seem pretty clear to me) and the fact that I don't believe that the body was cremated on a bonfire. Once those are out, then the only possible explanation is that he did it, but the police still decided to frame him, which seems pretty far fetched to me.

The person I really feel sorry for, though, is Dassey. Poor fucking kid.

superflyninja

Its odd to hear people talking about this in tv language, going on about spoilers and episodes and memes, with the boo hiss villains and the heroic defense lawyers( Im NOT talking about Len ;p ). But then you remember this is actually real, that Brendan and Steve are in prison and a woman has been murdered.

ShabbyMcCrabby

Y'all should watch the Jinx too.

Was gonna say more but doing that would ruin things.

RamSteelwood

mannaboy wrote:

Watched this over two days, half way through I started to think it wasn't a real doc, I just couldn't believe how incompetent the cops were, by design or accident, and the appalling treatment of Steven's nephew. But you couldn't make this shit up.

in the tv thread i asked if it was 'fake' after about 4 episodes...i didn't mean the case itself necessarily, i just began to think it was more of a really clever dramatisation of the case, a 'mocumentary' if you will. i still find it a bit odd how many times the camera would be in the face of a person taking an important call, or they'd be with the defence team as they happily chatted through their plans etc.

RamSteelwood

and like Shabby says, watch 'the Jinx' too.

Yossarian

Yes, The Jinx is great.

mk64

I can't believe it.

Someone a few pages back mentioned how on earth it could be the case that he could clean the crime scene but then park the rav4 really fucking close. Could've easily crushed it. Makes no sense.

Cop asking about plates too early

The vial.. I mean the fucking vial! Makes my blood boil - pun intended!

The way they talked Brendon into the confession was horrible to watch

I think the whole thing was set up. They were on the land 8 days. Plenty of time to set shit up. They searched the room 7 times before the key was found (not mentioning the prints).

It's crazy. But its the US.

Gamermike

Finally got round to watching the final episode tonight.

Compelling viewing. I really don't think he did it and feel desperately sorry for the kid.

I said to the Mrs though, this could only happen in America. Fuck that.

mistercrayon

Yep, that recording in courtrooms is certainly exclusive to America.

[Deleted User]

Its not the only country that would duck over an innocent man but probably the only one to go through this many theatrics to do it.

Roujin

Beano said it earlier in the thread guys when considering how fucked this case was and the 'only in america' aspect - Hillsborough.

ShabbyMcCrabby

Wassat?

Roujin

A crush of football fans that left a lot of people dead at a Liverpool game in the 1980s.

Was blamed on drunk fans. 30+ years later it was finally overturned and cops and local govt to shown up to be as crooked and lying as everyone present had said they were all along.

beano

Roujin wrote:

Beano said it earlier in the thread guys when considering how fucked this case was and the 'only in america' aspect - Hillsborough.

Not just that- there are plenty more from bankers, politico's expenses; of recent times to historic child trafficking/rape, police corruption, to name the most pertinent in my mind.

...we brits are a bit more shrewd (and defeatist) than the yanks when it comes to allowing institutions, which are meant to inform/serve/protect us, to continue to protect themselves of allowing heinous acts of ultra-violence and wanton-erosion of the principles and ideologies of a free and fair humane-society by blaming individuals and not their structures. e.g. nomenclatures such as, "The Jimmy Savile Scandal" as opposed to "The State Broadcaster Child Rape Ring."

Facewon

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/01/25/dead-certainty

Just an excellent read.

"A private investigative project, bound by no rules of procedure, is answerable only to ratings and the ethics of its makers."

mistercrayon

Good read.

ShabbyMcCrabby

Roujin wrote:

A crush of football fans that left a lot of people dead at a Liverpool game in the 1980s.

Was blamed on drunk fans. 30+ years later it was finally overturned and cops and local govt to shown up to be as crooked and lying as everyone present had said they were all along.

Police and gov at fault because of poor planning for crowds? How were they at fault for a crowd crush?

Dark Soldier

ShabbyMcCrabby wrote:

Roujin wrote:

A crush of football fans that left a lot of people dead at a Liverpool game in the 1980s. Was blamed on drunk fans. 30+ years later it was finally overturned and cops and local govt to shown up to be as crooked and lying as everyone present had said they were all along.

Police and gov at fault because of poor planning for crowds? How were they at fault for a crowd crush?

Watch this:

And this (which is a superb doc):

Dark Soldier

Seriously that 30 for 30 has to be watched by all. Was in tears by the end, absolutely horrific.

Facewon

ShabbyMcCrabby wrote:

Police and gov at fault because of poor planning for crowds? How were they at fault for a crowd crush?

Definitely watch vids ds linked.

ShabbyMcCrabby

Wilco when I get home, ta.

superflyninja

This makes for some interesting reading.

mk64

superflyninja wrote:

This makes for some interesting reading.

This is where i'm at pretty much.

RamSteelwood

nah, it makes too much sense!

Facewon

mk64 wrote:

superflyninja wrote:

This makes for some interesting reading.

This is where i'm at pretty much.

I feel dirty for reading that.

I dunno, I understand the intrigue and the wanting to speculate, I do it myself, but I hate myself for falling into the trap.

We don't know shit, and we should STFU.

For those people, and for others close to the original case, “Making a Murderer” seems less like investigative journalism than like highbrow vigilante justice. “My initial reaction was that I shouldn’t be upset with the documentarians, because they can’t help that the public reacted the way that it did,” Penny Beerntsen said. “But the more I thought about it, the more I thought, Well, yeah, they do bear responsibility, because of the way they put together the footage. To me, the fact that the response was almost universally ‘Oh, my God, these two men are innocent’ speaks to the bias of the piece. A jury doesn’t deliberate twenty-some hours over three or four days if the evidence wasn’t more complex.”

Anyhoo.

mistercrayon

We don't know why they took that long either though.

mistercrayon

I think I've been put off true crime now anyway. The truth is, the voyeurism is a bit gross for me.

Yossarian

mistercrayon wrote:

We don't know why they took that long either though.

We can find out, though. Through a crowdfunded effort the transcripts are now available.

Facewon wrote:

We don't know shit, and we should STFU.

Not knowing shit has never stopped us before.

mistercrayon

Ah, neat.

Did anyone think strang looked like iwata?

Howdy, Stranger!

Categories