Dinostar77 wrote:

he still appeals to the blue collar workers and vast swathes of the bible belt.

So exactly like Hitler then, man of the “people”. The rest of the world sits and watches and people will pay for this not just in America but everywhere if he gets in again.

Dinostar77 wrote:

The rioters really need some black leaders, to tell them to go home, get educated, use your vote to try to change things for the better. Dont like the chief of police? Dont like the guvnir of your state? Dont like the president? Well you live in a democracy, so use your vote.

A few issues with this. Black leaders? Those that gain power are compromised or killed in America. If you think white America will allow real black power you are being hopeful in the extreme.

We have already seen in previous elections how state by state there is so much corruption and vote rigging against Black people I can understand why a lot of them do not vote. What’s the point if your vote isn’t counted, or worse, you can’t even vote because some bullshit made up law is designed to suppress the black vote.

Get educated. Do you really think the level of education afforded to the poor black community is on a level with white society?

And this comes back to rioting. If everything is so heavily stacked against you what other outlet do you have? I’m not saying the response is right. In an ideal world the outlet would be the black community coming together and doing something more positive but none of them are living in an ideal world.

The US, like the UK, probably need an actual left wing party...

Yeah probably true. Bernie shows there's some hope I suppose, but also that those within will push back hard. Rather like Corbyn stuff here really...

They will push back hard for sure, but we've had several examples of outside candidates winning despite a concerted push from the DNC to defend incumbents.

Like third parties though, I do think one of the best places to start is locally. City councils and Mayoralties and state legislatures will often be able to make a more meaningful difference to peoples lives than Congress, and it's these downballot races the DNC frequently ignores in favour of national politics.

The number of cases of the police striking first, of using force against peaceful protests, is just staggering. Time and again it's been captured on camera, even during live broadcasts.

b0r1s wrote:

Dinostar77 wrote:

he still appeals to the blue collar workers and vast swathes of the bible belt.

So exactly like Hitler then, man of the “people”. The rest of the world sits and watches and people will pay for this not just in America but everywhere if he gets in again.

Dinostar77 wrote:

The rioters really need some black leaders, to tell them to go home, get educated, use your vote to try to change things for the better. Dont like the chief of police? Dont like the guvnir of your state? Dont like the president? Well you live in a democracy, so use your vote.

A few issues with this. Black leaders? Those that gain power are compromised or killed in America. If you think white America will allow real black power you are being hopeful in the extreme.

We have already seen in previous elections how state by state there is so much corruption and vote rigging against Black people I can understand why a lot of them do not vote. What’s the point if your vote isn’t counted, or worse, you can’t even vote because some bullshit made up law is designed to suppress the black vote.

Get educated. Do you really think the level of education afforded to the poor black community is on a level with white society?

And this comes back to rioting. If everything is so heavily stacked against you what other outlet do you have? I’m not saying the response is right. In an ideal world the outlet would be the black community coming together and doing something more positive but none of them are living in an ideal world.

Yeh, i think we can all safety say, the world would be better off with a statesman like president.

If you cant beat the system then join it and change it from within. What i said above is what Killer Mike said in the youtube post a few pages back, when he was addressing America's black community. Educate yourself, use your vote, kill the system by changing it.

You can self educate, go to a library, get a book. Or use your phone and read or watch stuff that educates you. I'm not saying you have to become a senator or a guvnor or president. Become the local mayor or counsellor, or chief of whatever. Take small bites of the elephant.

People have to have hope and belief that you can change the system, you can better yourself and make a better future for your children.

Dinostar77 wrote:

I'm not saying you have to become a senator or a guvnor or president. Become the local mayor or counsellor, or chief of whatever. Take small bites of the elephant. People have to have hope and belief that you can change the system, you can better yourself and make a better future for your children.

But what if you in fact, can't change the system?

Oooof. I'm out. If I read one more take on the riots that focuses on them over everything else in the situation and ignores the reaction to "black" resistance vs the reaction to white violence, ro ignores what happened to kapernick etc, also see voting shit already posted, then I dunno, maybe stfu and sit this one out.

It is hilarious (no wait the other thing, tragic) to see twats like Mike Pence telling people they should protest peacefully. Like, dickhead, you set up a stunt to leave a NFL game where there was a peaceful protest.

It's almost as if no form of protest is actually accepable to these people.

Dinostar77 wrote:

Yeh, i think we can all safety say, the world would be better off with a statesman like president. If you cant beat the system then join it and change it from within. What i said above is what Killer Mike said in the youtube post a few pages back, when he was addressing America's black community. Educate yourself, use your vote, kill the system by changing it. You can self educate, go to a library, get a book. Or use your phone and read or watch stuff that educates you. I'm not saying you have to become a senator or a guvnor or president. Become the local mayor or counsellor, or chief of whatever. Take small bites of the elephant. People have to have hope and belief that you can change the system, you can better yourself and make a better future for your children.

Not sure what makes you qualified to tell people living in a different country how to protest their own system. You talk about education, but you don't seem to know a great deal yourself. You're just coming across as ill-informed and patronising.

JonB wrote:

Dinostar77 wrote:

Yeh, i think we can all safety say, the world would be better off with a statesman like president. If you cant beat the system then join it and change it from within. What i said above is what Killer Mike said in the youtube post a few pages back, when he was addressing America's black community. Educate yourself, use your vote, kill the system by changing it. You can self educate, go to a library, get a book. Or use your phone and read or watch stuff that educates you. I'm not saying you have to become a senator or a guvnor or president. Become the local mayor or counsellor, or chief of whatever. Take small bites of the elephant. People have to have hope and belief that you can change the system, you can better yourself and make a better future for your children.

Not sure what makes you qualified to tell people living in a different country how to protest their own system. You talk about education, but you don't seem to know a great deal yourself. You're just coming across as ill-informed and patronising.

I am contributing to a discussion on an internet forum. Just because im not a published author like yourself doesnt mean you have to be a twat about it. Its a discussion forum. Dont like my posts? Then ignore them.

Btw, if you did read my post you will see i was echoing the comments of killer mikes press conference a few pages back. But as a white dude you probably know better than me (bame) or a black community leader (killer mike).

Facewon wrote:

Oooof. I'm out. If I read one more take on the riots that focuses on them over everything else in the situation and ignores the reaction to "black" resistance vs the reaction to white violence, ro ignores what happened to kapernick etc, also see voting shit already posted, then I dunno, maybe stfu and sit this one out.

There was a good article on kap published a few days ago. If i can find it again i will post the link.

Dinostar77 wrote:

b0r1s wrote:

Diluted Dante wrote:

Dinostar77 wrote:

I'm not saying you have to become a senator or a guvnor or president. Become the local mayor or counsellor, or chief of whatever. Take small bites of the elephant. People have to have hope and belief that you can change the system, you can better yourself and make a better future for your children.

But what if you in fact, can't change the system?

Spot on with this link Dante.

Thats terrible, stuff like that needs to change. You'd hope it can.

This is one of many systems in the USA that work like this.

There’s the system of minor infractions leading to serious jail time which helps fund states because they get paid from the federal government for incarcerated individuals. And you can guess which individuals they target. There’s are doc in Netflix about it, can’t remember what it’s called.

There’s this: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/mar/02/texas-polling-sites-closures-voting

There’s the voter suppression in Texas during the last election. Google it.

Stuff like this won’t change without revolution. White powerful people aren’t doing what they do in a nice way why should black people just sit and protest peacefully?

Dinostar77 wrote:

Yeh, i think we can all safety say, the world would be better off with a statesman like president. If you cant beat the system then join it and change it from within. What i said above is what Killer Mike said in the youtube post a few pages back, when he was addressing America's black community. Educate yourself, use your vote, kill the system by changing it. You can self educate, go to a library, get a book. Or use your phone and read or watch stuff that educates you. I'm not saying you have to become a senator or a guvnor or president. Become the local mayor or counsellor, or chief of whatever. Take small bites of the elephant. People have to have hope and belief that you can change the system, you can better yourself and make a better future for your children.

Not sure what makes you qualified to tell people living in a different country how to protest their own system. You talk about education, but you don't seem to know a great deal yourself. You're just coming across as ill-informed and patronising.

I am contributing to a discussion on an internet forum. Just because im not a published author like yourself doesnt mean you have to be a twat about it. Its a discussion forum. Dont like my posts? Then ignore them. Btw, if you did read my post you will see i was echoing the comments of killer mikes press conference a few pages back. But as a white dude you probably know better than me (bame) or a black community leader (killer mike).

Fun fact.
Did you know black people in the US couldn't vote until the race riots of the 1960's? Not to mention racial segregation like we saw in South Africa till the 90s. Perhaps rioting is exactly what is needed to change the system.
I'm not condoning violence but sometimes it's necessary to put your foot down and the only option if you want to change the system.

Rage against the machine?

Dinostar77 wrote:

b01rs, i dont disagree with you, i just dont see any other way out. what do you think the solution is? Or is that the impossible question? How does change happen?

I think extreme measures have to be taken sometimes. You need to fight for what you believe is right. History shows that revolution is sometimes needed and yes innocent people will get hurt and die, but thousands are dying unfairly everyday.

Off the top of my head (you can tell I’m no historian); suffragettes, Northern Ireland, civil rights, Russian Tsars and the ANC. All required violence to varying levels of extent.