Zelda - The Bear and Badger

LivDiv

So much of what made BotW great has appeared in other games since. Some of it has become the standard, some of it refined as BotW refined itself.

A straight sequel could end up feeling a bit ordinary. I'd lean into trusting Nintendo though. 6 years on the same hardware suggests it should offer something unique.

Moot_Geeza

BotW took 300 ppl 4yrs to make, from scratch. We've had a pandemic ofc, but if the team for this is of a comparable size I don't see the 'if they have time' stuff tbh. It should be utterly majestic/spectacular because its predecessor was, in 2017. Unless it turns out they binned a different game after like 2yrs and started afresh, Metroid style*

*Possibly.

If nothing else it'd be a shame to follow up one of the most astonishing gaming achievements of all time with a tardy continuation of the same basic formula. Ymmv. 3D Zelda was pretty much built on the basic OoT foundation up until BotW anyway, so I'm clearly being too optimistic.

Bob

The only way forward is to take a leaf out of the Ubisoft book. They’ve taken four years playing the last few far cries and it goes first person

Funkstain

Hot take: Nintendo were brave enough to reinvent the Zelda formula almost totally, and adapt / steal a ton of stuff from other IP (souls for one); they were rewarded with unprecedented commercial and critical acclaim.

The same people are in charge, and I can’t see them being happy with a botw2-lite approach, so I’m optimistic.

LivDiv

My reckon is the spectre of new hardware may have effected how long this has taken even if that is never apparent in the final product

They have to have considered new hardware in that time and conversations must have been had.

Funkstain

Do think Nintendo’s biggest weakness is the lack of synergy / compromises between software and hardware teams. It goes one way: software guys understand the hardware intimately, what they can extract from it, how they build around its weaknesses and enhance its strengths. But not the other way: the software guys have to live with zero compromise from hardware guys, who appear incentivised by cost control beyond all else.

There’s no: give me a little more tech, a bit more power and I can do this or that in game x or y. It’s “this is the hardware, make it work”

As DS has often lamented, imagine Nintendo software running on even slightly more cutting edge hardware: HDR is a game changer, DLSS and related tech is as good as 4K for most, 60FPS is a basic expectation these days

Switch Pro stuff has totally dropped off radar but they must be readying something. In these days of leaks and rumours though, I don’t believe it’s close, surely we’d have heard something?

Do people think BOTW2 comes with updated HW..?

Moot_Geeza

Switch Pro might've been scuppered by covid, assuming they were planning a One X/PS4 Pro type tech bump in the first place. I doubt the OG specs, OLED model was part of the original plan, even taking into account the fact that people will buy anything. A slightly crisper screen is hardly a game changer for playing low res, juddery indies and half-arsed first party sports games etc, but it's doing gangbusters afaik. For new adopters and existing owners, most probably.

LivDiv

Not day 1 but I think you'd be mad to not develop BotW2 4K parallel ready for when the hardware does release.

This is all assuming next hardware is a 4k Switch and not Nintendo going mental again.

Bob

Moot_Geeza wrote:

Switch Pro might've been scuppered by covid, assuming they were planning a One X/PS4 Pro type tech bump in the first place. I doubt the OG specs, OLED model was part of the original plan, even taking into account the fact that people will buy anything. A slightly crisper screen is hardly a game changer for playing low res, juddery indies and half-arsed first party sports games etc, but it's doing gangbusters afaik. For new adopters and existing owners, most probably.

You’re forgetting the improved kick stand and slightly more difficult to get out game carts. Game changer ! Quite literally!

Moot_Geeza

I've seen videos where people describe it as a game changer. But only to the extent that dusting your TV might make a difference to Phil Mitchell's face, surely?

Edit: I do think that some Switch games are gorgeous and some indie ports are miraculous, but the majority of everything that's also available elsewhere (and also a sizeable of chunk of Nintendo's own output these days) looks a bit rough. Tldr: It's OLD, whether you add the cheeky E or not.

monkey

DrewMerson wrote:

Removing weapon degradation breaks the game. I’d be up for them introducing crafting that extended the life of the weapon, perhaps improving its damage at the same time, but never indefinitely. I’d also be up for them removing the damage caused to shields by surfing on them.

If the weapons and general combat were better, I wouldn’t care so much. But a lot of the stuff you grab is bobbins. So being forced to switch to it mid-fight is not fun.

monkey

Also whatever the throw weapon button is needs to change to one I won’t accidentally press all the time.

monkey

And let me play if after completing the main quest for mop up action.

Funkstain

I dunno man, Nintendo hardware group have a long established habit of releasing incremental improvements and rinsing the shit out of decade old tech.

The various Gameboy releases, 3/2DS releases… switch OLED follows that model no?

4K be damned anyway, I’m happy with 1080, just want HDR and solid FPS

Moot_Geeza

Yeah fair, there must've been close to ten variations on the 3DS hardware I guess. It works and it sells, my opinion is probably based more on 'I don't like it' than 'it doesn't make sense'.

monkey

I don't need anything from them at the moment apart from games and and joycons that don't break when touched.

EvilRedEye

From the sound of it, there was going to be a mid-gen refresh that was scuppered by Covid and was scaled back into the OLED model. I think there was some acknowledgment of this found in the firmware, developers telling Digital Foundry stuff etc.

Word on the streetz is we're now looking at a full-on Switch 2 launching early next year.

Dark Soldier

I will admit that Nintendo games in 4k at 60fps on PC are fucking stunning to look at. Mad to me how Nintendo actively gimp it when their colourful style lends itself so well to higher res and frames.

Funkstain

Fuck em if they release botw2 this year then upgraded version with switch 2 next year

Moot_Geeza

Maybe the Switch 2 will iron out the framerate issues on Switch 1 games. Some first party games are choppier undocked (or in one case I can think of, have their fps ceiling sliced in half), so perhaps they're already programmed in a way that would make HW boosting possible without too much tinkering. Isn't it set/locked framerates that prevents certain PS4/Xbox One games from receiving next gen smoothness bumps?

Bob

There’ll be no switch 2

Blue Swirl

Dark Soldier wrote:

I will admit that Nintendo games in 4k at 60fps on PC are fucking stunning to look at. Mad to me how Nintendo actively gimp it when their colourful style lends itself so well to higher res and frames.

Are they gimping it, or y'know, making sure it runs on their hardware?

Dark Soldier

If the hardware wasn't gimped, then yeah

Blue Swirl

I’m lost.

Bob

He suggesting they're hardware is holding them back.. You're both making the same point. Nothing to see here.

MattyJ

He's saying if Nintendo released a PS5/Series X equivalent rather than choosing to actively produce a less powerful matching then these games would look incredible

Moot_Geeza

Just a portable PS4/Bone equivalent would be nice pls.

Syph79

Getting the Steam Deck, or equivalent, into the Switch’s profile will be the challenge.

Bob

And the battery life - steam decks can do less than 2 hours

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