What is its role, actually.

Oops.

Interesting to see how things are reported. Reporters of all stripes generally agreed Corbyn did well with Andrew Neil, and Neil didn't really get anywhere with the IRA questioning.  Just found on The Express a video titled "Corbyn flounders as Andrew Neil lays into him over IRA links".

I wish Guru-Murthy had held off a bit longer before springing the trap.  Fallon was providing more rope to hang himself when he was interrupted.

Diluted Dante wrote:

Interesting to see how things are reported. Reporters of all stripes generally agreed Corbyn did well with Andrew Neil, and Neil didn't really get anywhere with the IRA questioning.  Just found on The Express a video titled "Corbyn flounders as Andrew Neil lays into him over IRA links".

I thought Neil got him bang to rights tbh. Corbyn didn't have much of a defence (not one he wanted to articulate anyway).

Yossarian wrote:

not because the Guardian is secretly right wing and/or neoliberal, but because the Guardian does not see that as its role.

It sells on left-wing presentation, a facade that successfully hides a few of its values from the majority of its readers. It has some good articles, but it also tries to subvert what most liberals want from this country to what it tells them to want.

It's an influencer in upmarket left-wing clothes that doesn't show the courage of its purported convictions. It betrays many of the beliefs that it uses as currency.

Na, just the one poll with 5. Other polls showing 10 point lead, labour at best in low 30s.

Escape wrote:

Yossarian wrote:

not because the Guardian is secretly right wing and/or neoliberal, but because the Guardian does not see that as its role.

It sells on left-wing presentation, a facade that successfully hides a few of its values from the majority of its readers. It has some good articles, but it also tries to subvert what most liberals want from this country to what it tells them to want.

It's an influencer in upmarket left-wing clothes that doesn't show the courage of its purported convictions. It betrays many of the beliefs that it uses as currency.

It has differing opinions to many liberals, and certainly isn't as radical as many would like, but the idea that it is making some wilful attempt to subvert radical ideas is fanciful, IMO.

Whether intentional or not (depends on how conspiratorial your mindset), the effect is the same, to take any radical leftwing sensibility that might develop and reroute it back towards moderation and 'being reasonable' via the medium of well meaning but useless liberalism, a slightly more ethical brand of consumer capitalism and vague hippy-dippy niceness.

IMO, etc.

EDIT: it's not all the Guardian's fault of course, the generally shitty nature of their competition isn't to be blamed on them, nor the fact that they simply found themselves touted as the most leftwing of a narrow consensus by the hopelessly limited nature of what's available on the news racks. It also doesn't mean to say that good things can't sneak out from Guardian towers.

Talking of it being the New Labour of print, I saw Corbyn being described as an accidental Blairite recently (not in the Graun) which I thought was pretty good.

I mean, I'd expect fewer wars under Corbyn than Blair, obvs.

Btw, all the major pollsters are now weighing in favour of Tories in these polls - a 4% lead in actual data becomes 10%. "Because 2015" basically, the turnout rate for Tory voters was so much higher. I go by the voteuk forum, a nerd forum for psephologists and party campaigner types. Worth a gander.

Still fancy over 100 majority for El May.

legaldinho wrote:

Btw, all the major pollsters are now weighing in favour of Tories in these polls - a 4% lead in actual data becomes 10%. "Because 2015" basically, the turnout rate for Tory voters was so much higher. I go by the voteuk forum, a nerd forum for psephologists and party campaigner types. Worth a gander.

Well, some changed their weighting, some changed their sample, and others did both. Until the election though, no one knows which approach is the best.

No embarrassment at public-school gates, I'm sure.