Brexit: Boris' Big Belgian Bangers - The Bear and Badger

LivDiv

Oh large portions of this mess are very much May's fault.
Not least the stupidly tight deadline we are now on because she delayed the vote.

SpaceGazelle

I doubt it will make any difference. It's either no deal or stopping it, and they don't seem likely either. Nothing seems remotely like it belongs in this Universe tbh. Maybe I'm dreaming the whole thing.

Roujin

I get that Corbyn is waiting for this to happen, then trying to step in at the next GE under the auspices of cleaning up this tory shitfuck that they'll leave behind, but for me, this just seems exactly the sort of behaviour people are fucking tired of.

He can't make a GE happen on his own, sure, but he should be railing for it right now, he should be busy laying out all the shit he would be doing if he was in May's position, but he can't because he wants to leave but doesn't want to have to say it because it's going to cost him a lot of remain voters votes. It's so fucking dumb, I wish someone would just sit him down and give his head a wobble. If he doesn't want to be in the EU he can still say which bits of it he doesn't like as his reason for leaving and his policy ideas that he could enact if we were free that he couldnt if we were still in.

Which is what is giving me some ever growing doubts about him lately because the conjecture from people with relevant levels of expertise is that brexit will hurt, hard brexit will be extra hurty and staying in the EU will be the less hurty status quo but have to eat humble pie for a while and get dunked on for free in the future by EU MEPs trolling us over quotas saying if we don't like X why don't we just leave lololololol x infinity. So why is he clearly sticking to his leave plan. His party want remain, the public majority now most likely would vote remain in a second ref, so either present your magical post brexit plan, or start campaigning for a total remain, because I can't see how his current strategy doesn't end up with him looking like he doesn't know what he's doing, or that he's just as thick as all the other people who think leaving will be a "good thing".

I would prefer gamesmanship to fuck off out of politics to be honest but that seems incredibly unlikely. Gigantic NO FUCKING WAY PAL to May's deal, and yet May will have her own rebel MPs who told her to do one yesterday vote on her side in the confidence motion because they're going to put the party ahead of common sense and the logical course of action following yesterday's vote results.

Don't get me wrong, I love Jezza, you can go back in this thread and find me sucking his dick, but lately he's starting to look and act like he's just reacting to things in the manner which is going to try and please as many voters as possible, instead of leading on the debate and saying THESE IDEAS ARE TRASH WHAT ARE YOU DOING? WHY AREN'T YOU DOING x, Y, Z MAY, YOU THUNDERCUNT?

Diluted Dante

WorKid wrote:

There's a whole generation who should be flocking to this Labour banner for all sorts of reasons, but who feel deeply betrayed by 1) the actual lack of campaigning by JC during the referendum

This can fuck the fuck off. He campaigned heavily, but didnt recieve the same coverage as the Tories did. You can argue about it being a strategic mistake not to share a platform with the Tories, but it was a reasonable decision not to based on it being electoral poison to have done so in the Scottish Referendum

WorKid

How can you campaign heavily and not receive coverage? That's either wilfully staying out of the spotlight or failing to get your message out. Either way he wasn't visible during the referendum.

Wasn't he "seven out of ten" in favour of the EU or some other lukewarm nonsense?

Diluted Dante

WorKid wrote:

How can you campaign heavily and not receive coverage? That's either wilfully staying out of the spotlight or failing to get your message out. Either way he wasn't visible during the referendum. Wasn't he "seven out of ten" in favour of the EU or some other lukewarm nonsense?

Almost no one in the country is any more than 7 out of ten.

pantyfire

I'm hearing lots of "If this doesn't go ahead, I'll never vote again" rhetoric from the leavers.
Please never vote again.

LivDiv

Yeah, I thought the same.

You take your poorly informed opinions and stay at home, I won't shed a tear.

Armitage_Shankburn

Armitage_Shankburn wrote:

I don't really understand you lot. He's ambivalent about the EU. Are you not ambivalent about it? It's weird this sudden absolute love for a largely neoliberal, gargantuan bureaucratic engine of compromise, staffed by technocrats, with all sorts of core flaws. I don't remember any of you declaiming for Brussels in any year prior to 2015. Nor should you.

I don't understand how anyone can be anything but ambivalent about it. The point of voting remain is that it does more good than bad, that European nation states would be fucked without something like it, and overall it has delivered a half century of peace. If Corbyn's crime is to be ambivalent but leaning remain, he's par imo.

Plus, there is a movement now to reform it. It's up to nation states. And the left can leverage nationalism as a threat to put pressure.

I love how people like wrkid are criticising Corbo for 7/10.

7/10 is the absolute highest rating any sensible person can give the EU. I'm fucking shocked Corbo gave it that high a rating.

I can't stand this kind of disingenuous fluff. Brexit, promised in abtory manifesto, the result of decades of propaganda and manoeuvres by a Tory press, a Tory prime minister calling it, and led by tories (blue or red) on both sides of the campaign, when it's devastating effect will take hold, is the fault of Corbyn.

Complete nonsense. Get your head examined.

Armitage_Shankburn

pantyfire wrote:

I'm hearing lots of "If this doesn't go ahead, I'll never vote again" rhetoric from the leavers.
Please never vote again.

You are living in fantasy land if you think this will be the consequence of remaining.

pantyfire

I'm looking forward to the pitched battles in the streets against the fascists.
They're can be a bounty of 50p per fascist tail.

LarryDavid

pantyfire wrote:

I'm looking forward to the pitched battles in the streets against the fascists.
They're can be a bounty of 50p per fascist tail.

Everyone will be too busy arguing amongst themselves about Corbyn and how shit he is. The fascists will have a free reign.

“At least we knew which side of the European debate Combat 18 were on, not like that slippery bearded fucker!”

GooberTheHat

May survives by 19 votes.

LivDiv

Corbyn demands ruling out no deal before talks.

monkey

All that seems to unite the Tories at the moment is they don't want another election. Maybe she should have said if MPs didn't put her deal through she'd try and dissolve Parliament.

regmcfly

Fucking pathetic

SpaceGazelle

I have no confidence that this no confidence vote will yield anything useful.

regmcfly

It hasn't. She won

kneecap

LivDiv wrote:

Corbyn demands ruling out no deal before talks.

Jesus Christ the negotiations are between the UK and EU not the UK and UK.

SpaceGazelle

So what now then?

monkey

Fairly outrageous really that they would have lost but for the votes of a party that they've paid with public money to keep them in office.

kneecap

monkey wrote:

Fairly outrageous really that they would have lost but for the votes of a party that they've paid with public money to keep them in office.

Which breaks the Good Friday agreement, but sure what has that ever done for us. Fucking Irish killing themselves etc.

RedDave2

SpaceGazelle wrote:

So what now then?

I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit.

LivDiv

kneecap wrote:

LivDiv wrote:

Corbyn demands ruling out no deal before talks.

Jesus Christ the negotiations are between the UK and EU not the UK and UK.

Yes and no.
The meaningful vote means it is an internal agreement first. Followed by an external agreement.

Or at least it should have been. Instead Little Hitler May decided it was her deal to own. Then failed miserably.

kneecap

Yes but article 50 is triggered which means No Deal is the default position.

LivDiv

kneecap wrote:

Yes but article 50 is triggered which means No Deal is the default position.

Yes. But that doesnt mean it can't be avoided.

May's deal was the hardest possible deal going, there is plenty of room to come closer to the EU and avoid the backstop. Meaning it would pass commons and the EU.

No deal is afucking stupid move for literally everybody involved. What Corbyn is basically asking is for May to stop using it as a threat and negotiate properly.

Yossarian

May should have created a national unity government a long time ago, it would have been better than paying off the DUP.

Yossarian

The Graun has quoted some of Watson’s speech. It’s pretty good.

First let me say very clearly that I am not one of those people who questioned [May’s] motives.

I agree with [Tory MP Stephen Kerr] who claimed she was motivated by public duty.

I don’t doubt that she has sincerely attempted to fulfil the task given to us by the voters in the referendum.

I have no doubt that she has tried her best and given it her all. But she has failed. And I’m afraid the failure is hers. Hers alone ...

Throughout history prime ministers have tried their best and failed. There is no disgrace in that. That’s politics.

But this prime minister has chosen one last act of defiance – not just defying the laws of politics, but defying the laws of mathematics.

It was a Disraeli who said “a majority is always better than the best repartee”. She is a prime minister without a majority for her flagship policy, with no authority and no plan B.

Mr Speaker … that’s not a mere flesh wound

No one doubts her determination, which is generally an admirable quality, but misapplied it can be toxic ...

We know [May] has worked hard. But the truth is she is too set in her ways, too aloof to lead.

She lacks the imagination and agility to bring people with her.

She lacks the authority on the world stage to negotiate this deal.

Ultimately she has failed. It is not through lack of effort. It is not through a lack of dedication.

And I think the country recognises that effort. In fact the country feels genuinely sorry for the prime minister.

I feel sorry for the prime minister. But she cannot confuse pity for political legitimacy, sympathy for sustainable support.

SpaceGazelle

Here's Dave not giving a shit.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46891771

LivDiv

I was expecting a video of him on a jet ski, doing a ride by splashing of reporters as they try to shout brexit questions at him. He just burns off shouting "what maaaate".

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