Death Stranding - Kojima/Reedus - The Bear and Badger

Tempy

Almost pulled the trigger on this tonight after listening to the C&C podcast crew try and digest the first 3 hours of it. According to Marsh Davies, Rich Stanton was furious about it on a WhatsApp group before coming round to it later and calling it amazing. That's enough for me. But I have a draft of a lit review to do, so I needed to focus on that instead. Sigh.

LivDiv

I watched a breakdown of the ending.

Spoiler:

GurtTractor

Is Kojima kinda like the Tarantino of games?

Minnesänger

Tempy wrote:

Almost pulled the trigger on this tonight after listening to the C&C podcast crew try and digest the first 3 hours of it. According to Marsh Davies, Rich Stanton was furious about it on a WhatsApp group before coming round to it later and calling it amazing. That's enough for me. But I have a draft of a lit review to do, so I needed to focus on that instead. Sigh.

It’ll be there when you have time, bud. I think you’d get a lot out of it, to be honest, but it’s also a bit of a time sink.

LivDiv

@Gurt
Very much so imo.
I dont want either to change or be influenced or get an editor or a proper gameplay developer or anything else.
Gotta take the wank with the good, it is a price worth paying.

Tempy

After my massive spiel in Anime & Manga today I just think what Kojima does is more culturally “done” in a society that’s used to having one person have near limitless control of their property beyond an editor, assistant and publisher. Games are obviously hugely different to manga, and the idea that everything in a Kojima game is 100% his is hugely questionable (Fukushima turns up as a writing credit in games from MGS to Snake Eater) especially when you have such a unique artistic vision present in Yoji Shinkawa, but you still see creative control given over to one person’s whims much more readily in Japan than you do over here. I absolutely think you have to take the good with the bad, which will never stop me being critical of the bad, but i’ve long expressed an interesting in unique broken things than safe, competent things.

mrsmr2

Minnesänger wrote:

I’ve seen the line “that’s classic hideo Kojima” in the game. There’s a lot of that stuff.

I’m much less bothered by that than advertising products.

dynamiteReady

GurtTractor wrote:

Is Kojima kinda like the Tarantino of games?

Hmm... Has too much money behind him... Probably closer the Wachowski Brothers, or perhaps a James Cameron.

I'd say because of the position Jonathan Blow occupies (critically acclaimed, fiercely independent), he might be 'closer' to Tarrantino, but thematically, neither Koj, or Blow are close enough.

Perhaps closer still would be CD Projekt. Though judging by the development of the Witcher franchise, they're very beholden to their fans...

I think this type of comparison game would make for an interesting thread... We should do it, before Edge does... :'P

Paul the sparky

mrsmr2 wrote:

Believe it or not, I have been starting to consider getting this.

What's brought this on? Are you starting to see the appeal or is it out of morbid curiosity?

mrsmr2

Because I enjoy walking around nice environments and that part appeals - to some extent. I’m less bothered about the cut scenes and guff. I also can see the game is a tad tedious.

So considering it, with reservations - but not at the current price.

Minnesänger

Cutscene wise the game is front loaded with long-ish sections between chapters as you wander around until you wanna move on. There’s only short mini scenes in between. It’s less intrusive than, say, Metal Gear Solid.

Minnesänger

A spoilery review that, imo, nails what makes the game work:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKdv-IeAv2g

I've been thinking about this game non-stop since I started playing it, and I've tried to let initial love give way to a clearer sense of what I really think about it.

Fact is, besides Nier and The Last Guardian, it's the best game i've played this gen.

g.man

Ha! I watched that review last night. It's very good.

Tempy

Big contrary Cinty energy has me enthused

Minnesänger

Realised The Witcher 3 should be in contention there (as in, best games this Gen). We'll see where I settle on it come completion.

Minnesänger

Tempy wrote:

Big contrary Cinty energy has me enthused

I think even if you hate it, which you could do, you'll have something to say. You can say many things about this game, but it's not vacuous. It has incredibly strong themes. It's flawed and awkward and Kojima's dialogue and pacing has issues, but it's a hell of an experience.

There's been a kind of thought going around that Kojima isn't great at story. For me, that's bull. He's amazing at story. But, as mentioned, there are delivery issues. MGS2 and 3, especially, show how good he is when he reaches his potential - some of the most prescient and political works in the AAA space ever made.

This isn't MGS3 level, but it rivals 2.

hylian_elf

Minnesänger wrote:

For me, though, it’s genuinely compelling and probably the most interesting and emotive game I’ve played since Nier.

Just seen this. I’m sold on it now. Will buy at next opportunity I get.

hylian_elf

Minnesänger wrote:

Fact is, besides Nier and The Last Guardian, it's the best game i've played this gen.

Just seen this. I’m even more sold on it now. Will buy this weekend.

Tempy

Just seen this. Even more sold on it. Have somehow already bought it, three day ago?

Minnesänger

hylian_elf wrote:

Minnesänger wrote:

Fact is, besides Nier and The Last Guardian, it's the best game i've played this gen.

Just seen this. I’m even more sold on it now. Will buy this weekend.

Now I'm gonna feel guilty if you hate it....

Spoiler:

digi

Man this game!
I just can't explain why I love it so much.

Paul the sparky

Minnesänger wrote:

A spoilery review that, imo, nails what makes the game work:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKdv-IeAv2g

I've been thinking about this game non-stop since I started playing it, and I've tried to let initial love give way to a clearer sense of what I really think about it.

Fact is, besides Nier and The Last Guardian, it's the best game i've played this gen.

"The gameplay simulates the misery in the narrative."

Stick that quote on the box.

Minnesänger

Paul the sparky wrote:

A spoilery review that, imo, nails what makes the game work: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKdv-IeAv2g I've been thinking about this game non-stop since I started playing it, and I've tried to let initial love give way to a clearer sense of what I really think about it. Fact is, besides Nier and The Last Guardian, it's the best game i've played this gen.

"The gameplay simulates the misery in the narrative." Stick that quote on the box.

Agreed. It also simulates the optimism. To flourish you need to suffer.

Paul the sparky

Ah, it's a game for masochists.

Minnesänger

I'm a professional sadist, tbf. I get a lot out of it.

Fall you fucker, yeah....drop your cargo.

Tempy

LivDiv wrote:

I watched a breakdown of the ending.

Spoiler:

It is amazing the shite people will swallow when it is a video game.

Well, that's not fair. People will also swallow shit in Anime, Manga, Superhero Films, Star Wars, Star Trek ohhhh myyy GOOOODDDD

regmcfly

It's really interesting the way things get considered in different mediums. This year I saw "Weathering With You" a movie from the director of ,"Your Name" and it's a movie that ends with

Spoiler:

There's a political point for sure, but the audible gasp of the audience with that concept was sure different I'm sure than were it with a game.

LivDiv

Tempy wrote:

LivDiv wrote:

I watched a breakdown of the ending.

Spoiler:

It is amazing the shite people will swallow when it is a video game.

Well, that's not fair. People will also swallow shit in Anime, Manga, Superhero Films, Star Wars, Star Trek ohhhh myyy GOOOODDDD

Busted!

bad_hair_day

Some people also spit the shit out and others will say how much they enjoyed the sweetcorn.

Tempy

Not you of course, just everyone else

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