Additionally I think working class is simply not big anymore. Manual labour (skilled or unskilled) just doesn't exist on the same scale anymore. Tempy is my definition of precariat class, which I think is the newish "stomped on" class. Precarious: uncertain jobs, uncertain income, uncertain future, no material wealth to fall back on. no rights no unions few opportunities

Plumbers can be super rich and yet firmly "working class".

Diluted Dante wrote:

I'm not convinced that in a country that pivoted to the service sector, working in an office 'moves you up'

actually you're right. Definitely need to differentiate between call centre type office and "I work for Sky" or "I work for EE" in some marketing, brand, product, sales etc capacity

It's a tickable option, aye.

haha

Moot_Geeza wrote:

It's a tickable option, aye.

OK have done the survey. I get it: the "cultural signifiers" of and by themselves may be indicative of class to some extent (opera) but in reality, the more you tick (so, opera AND rap) the more "elite" you are - it represents your mixed interests and wide social circles which go beyond narrow signifiers. I mean dismiss as you wish but there is no doubt that "upper, middle and working" doesn't really describe any real UK society post WW2

tech middle class, precariat, and elite seem sensible additions to the range for my money (ha)

haha again, and exactly yes

I was expecting at least another page of cultural activity options, no sign of bingo or wine tasting.

I can't be caught dead in those polyester rags at Abigail's party!

Gremill wrote:

bad_hair_day wrote:

Fuck off, I'm always being dragged around them.

Lifetime Member

I'd have thought Iceland would be rather to cold for a phallological museum, but did have a warm experience at the one in Amsterdam.

Class is definitely interesting, but current modes are outdated. Working class seems to be where most people would situate themselves, and I think it’s part of the whole cultivation of aspiration. I think the gulf between lower working class and upper working class is so massive as to be utterly ridiculous, the circumstances you can be in in such a huge classification are almost worlds apart. You can be working class cos you do a service/manual job etc or your parents are from a certain background, but still be incredibly financially secure.

I always thought I was technically lower middle class cos my mum was a regional secretary, my dad/step dad worked in upper retail-ish roles, and my grandparents were long retired. But I have never earned higher than £16k, and my parents didn’t survive the financial crash and now both sets live on a shoe string which has seen them undertake massive lifestyle changes. Certainly the idea of any financial support from them is laughable. There’s no safety net for me bar the one I clawed together myself over a long time of squirrelling away uni living allowances by skipping meals, working overtime in shit jobs, and so on.

I think really what’s happened is comfort and security levels have massively shifted and there’s now probably a much lower floor to the working class, or a sub class underneath that - some financially doomed class that has given up on the working aspiration because it’s a system that doesn’t work any more. But by the same stroke those people can be university graduates who via access to the internet can be more broadly cultured than the traditional
working class role signifiers would suggest, and at the same stroke you can have apprentices and manual labourers making well over the national average, but because they’re in the work>success>class funnel they’d label themselves as working class despite owning two cars, a house, a pet, and having a holiday once a year.

A holiday man, a fucking holiday. I think i’ve had two in ten years?

Anyway class is real, but it’s incredibly complex.

I hope to die quietly.

I'm Elite.  Which I was pretty happy about until this happened:

bad_hair_day wrote:

Elite.

Makes me think i might be one of the plebs after all...

Until he gets the bowl out for the keys. Time to make your excuses and leg it.

I thought the bowl was just for cocktails. Not cock tales.

Also, don't use the knife in any of the bathrooms