Work - The pros and the cons... - The Bear and Badger

Jaco

Yossarian wrote:

I've spent my time in non-desk jobs, my desk one is far, far better for my mental wellbeing. Maybe not physical (although doing regular hours and having a proper weekend is not to be sniffed at, and less common in non-desk jobs), but based on my experience, I'd pick a desk job every single time.

Weird. I've had manual jobs, retail jobs and desk jobs. Without exception, the desk based work is the most boring, soul-destroying and physically rubbish. It's also been the office jobs where I've come under the most pressure to work long hours, late nights, weekends, take work home etc.

I did use a standing desk for a while and that was better. But it got taken away when I handed my notice in. And it still wasn't anywhere near as good as the manual work I've done.

Random list of Jim's jobs, in no particular order, because why not:

CURRENT: Freelance graphic designer / illustrator / copywriter (6 months and counting...)
Pros: Creative, varied, some clients are nice.
Cons: Most clients aren't nice, feast or famine nature of the work, chained to a desk for 10-12 hours a day, constant last-minute rush as clients never leave enough time, creative directors are mostly smeg-heads, stress, difficulty getting paid.

PREVIOUS: Employed graphic designer / illustrator / copywriter (18 years)
Pros: Creative (ish), varied (ish), that one client that's nice.
Cons: Most clients aren't nice, chained to a desk for up to 14 hours a day, expectation to work 70 hour weeks, office politics, brutal agency environment, constant last-minute rush as clients never leave enough time, creative directors are mostly smeg-heads, soul-crushing stress levels, realisation that most people that run agencies couldn't give a monkey's left nut about quality or creative integrity, nowhere near as well paid as people think.

PREVIOUS: Employed signage designer / manufacturer / fitter (3 years)
Pros: 9-5 with very little overtime, creative, extremely varied, hands-on, some nice clients, lots of time outdoors and in the workshop, stay very fit.
Cons: Most clients aren't nice, constant H&S violations, getting dust under vinyl wraps can is a pain.

PREVIOUS: Self-employed window cleaner (2 years before I injured myself)
Pros: Stay very fit, never earn less than £200 a day, people are generally nice to you, choose your own hours, working outdoors, sunny days, people seem keen to pay (which is odd).
Cons: Constant risk of injury, occasionally you see naked old people, spiders, some people look down on you for having a menial job (this soon stops when they find out you're earning twice what they earn in an office), SPIDERS.

PREVIOUS: Retail (I lasted 3 months!)
Pros: Goofing off in the warehouse was always fun... other than that... er...
Cons: People are horrid, colleagues aren't much better, hours are shocking, shop music, rubbish wages, management are universally incompetent and passive aggressive (or just plain aggressive), can feel your soul gradually being sucked out through your ears.

So yeah. Not sure what that achieved, but I feel better now.

[Deleted User]

I was the fittest I have ever been working retail for a year.
John Lewis rugs department. Spent all day moving rugs that weigh a fair old bit. The real workout was hanging them on those vertical sliding walls. Used the same muscle groups as overhand chin ups.
Next best was working the delivery dock in a warehouse, stacking washing machines on top of each other.

Jaco

Liveinadive wrote:

Next best was working the delivery dock in a warehouse, stacking washing machines on top of each other.

Oh heck yeah. That'd do it. A couple months of that and you'd be a beast.

Yossarian

As I say, I think it depends on the job an awful lot. A shite job on your feet all day is still a shite job, same with a desk job. The difference for me with a desk job is the amount of energy that I have left at the end of the day to do things I actually want to do. And I have my weekends free, which is just glorious. Plus, my current job puts no pressure on me for overtime or anything like that.

[Deleted User]

Yeah, you have a job in a good place there Yoss.
Unfortunately the creative field is a bloody nightmare for unpaid overtime. It is an industry wide scandal really.
Fuck all in the way of unions as well.

Jaco

Yossarian wrote:

As I say, I think it depends on the job an awful lot. A shite job on your feet all day is still a shite job, same with a desk job.

No doubt at all. Absolutely agree. Hell would be standing behind the deli counter in Asda day after day. Those people are heroes.

Yossarian wrote:

The difference for me with a desk job is the amount of energy that I have left at the end of the day to do things I actually want to do.

Not sure I can agree with that. I've always found that physically tough jobs (once I'm used to them) leave me with more energy as I'm fitter. Desk jobs tend to do the opposite as I find I'm less fit and that I'm mentally/emotionally drained at the end of the day – which is much worse than physical tiredness.

Yossarian wrote:

And I have my weekends free, which is just glorious. Plus, my current job puts no pressure on me for overtime or anything like that.

That is awesome, very true. Weekends are sacred. And if you've found the holy grail of a decent paid office job that doesn't require daft hours, then I doff my cap to you sir.

Liveinadive wrote:

Yeah, you have a job in a good place there Yoss. Unfortunately the creative field is a bloody nightmare for unpaid overtime. It is an industry wide scandal really.

My record, including work I had to take home to hit deadlines, was an almost 100 hour week. That was the breaking point.

Dark Soldier

Liveinadive wrote:

Next best was working the delivery dock in a warehouse, stacking washing machines on top of each other.

That's my next goal for work, warehouse. I never want retail, phone work or the majority of office work.

ShabbyMcCrabby

I quite enjoy doing shift work at the moment. 9-5 always drags me down mentally as it's the same routine every day every week. I like having sleep ins before work some days or getting home at 2pm from work others or working overnight which means (if you can manage your sleep) you get the whole day off. Plus midweek golf is best golf.

It helps that I have zero life commitments though. I'm not quite sure how some of my colleagues manage it with their partners who only have weekends off or they have young kids that they'd be away from overnight or whatever.

My previous job was flexi-time where I could turn up whenever and as long as I did my hours it was fine. I liked that too.

Retail was something I should have left a lot earlier than I did but it reaches some good skills. How to get stepped on by the general public for one. And also how to climb on TVs to grab other TVs that are stacked way higher than OHS would ever really allow in a death trap fire hazard. Just thinking about the storage area of the Chelsea Richer Sounds makes me shudder, literally no way out if a fire started.

RedDave2

Definitely prefer the physical work over the desk work in my job. There's a buzz, a challenge, adrenaline. With the desk days I tend to be running over pages of weights, prices and stats. I come home much more tired those days

Yossarian

Not sure I can agree with that. I've always found that physically tough jobs (once I'm used to them) leave me with more energy as I'm fitter. Desk jobs tend to do the opposite as I find I'm less fit and that I'm mentally/emotionally drained at the end of the day – which is much worse than physical tiredness.

You should try teaching for a while. There's a special type of exhaustion that comes from being on your feet and essentially performing all day long.

[Deleted User]

@DS
Aim for driver's mate or dock roles.
Picking is the exploitative shit at the moment.

Driver's mate is the best job if you don't mind minimum wage

Dark Soldier

Liveinadive wrote:

@DS Aim for driver's mate or dock roles. Picking is the exploitative shit at the moment. Driver's mate is the best job if you don't mind minimum wage

I got offered a driver's mate role last summer but turned it down due to gardening. Will get looking.

[Deleted User]

You might have to do routes but you are easily smart enough for that. Then it is just a case of hoping you get a good driver.

When I did it for JL I was told my driver was a total cunt, he once returned a mate to the depot and said he would rather do it himself.
As it was I knew the dipshit he returned from school and knew he was a spaz, so that was an ice breaker, from then on we got along great.

Dark Soldier

Heh class

Unlikely

I have an office job. I am currently working from bed.

HawBawJaws

Most tiring/draining jobs I had were in the casinos and bookies.

In the casino, you're literally paid to think fast, usually on your feet, for hours at a time. Depending on how busy/short staffed it was, you could be stuck on a busy roulette or punto table for up to 5 hours. That's 5 hours of carrying out complex mental arithmetic over and over again, dealing with multiple customers at a time, all while trying to control (hustle) the table and remain compliant with legislation and dealing procedures. Could be tough, but could also be really enjoyable.

Bookies, now there's a job. 14 hour shifts, dealing with some complete and utter arseholes all day long. Single manning for most of the day, people wanting to take your head off because THEY were late getting to the counter, or because THEY wrote the wrong number on their betting slip. Under constant threat of being robbed at gunpoint off a junkie for £300, watching grown men break down crying because they've spent their wife's funeral money in the betting machines and now they can't afford a headstone for her grave.

And that's before I even mention working in bingo halls.

Fuck going back into gambling. Wouldn't do it for a pension.

Skerret

Yossarian wrote:

Not sure I can agree with that. I've always found that physically tough jobs (once I'm used to them) leave me with more energy as I'm fitter. Desk jobs tend to do the opposite as I find I'm less fit and that I'm mentally/emotionally drained at the end of the day – which is much worse than physical tiredness.

You should try teaching for a while. There's a special type of exhaustion that comes from being on your feet and essentially performing all day long.

Yup.

@Jaws fuckin ell

tigersgogrrr

Teaching types - Do all deputies go on the leadership pay scale?

Stopharage

What type of deputy Tiger?

tigersgogrrr

Deputy head at a small Primary.

Note - I would potentially just be covering the role during maternity leave. Not sure how or if that impacts pay.

Stopharage

Not sure about Primary, but I'd presume a Deputy Head would have to be on leadership scale. Be very surprised if it was the head alone.

cockbeard

Been a while but as I recall the leadership scale was built for heads, deputies, heads of years and departments

However many schools are tight as hell and likely won't put you on it especially for a temp position, attempting to butter you up with the old "experience" "look good on the cv" bullshit, or perhaps I'm still bitter about that school last year that tried screwing me over after we'd agreed a salary

HawBawJaws

Wouldn't covering maternity mean it's basically a 9 (or however long) month secondment? We had a manager go off on maternity so we gave a supervisor her job on secondent to cover it. To all intents and purposes she's a manager now. Had to do a variation of contract, but she's getting the management wages for it.

tigersgogrrr

Idea has been kicked into touch anyway. Likely to have the job in a year if the current deputy leaves or goes part time after having her baby.

Will likely go into year 6 as prep. I'm down with this, though I won't be getting the £10k pay rise I'd started eyeing up!

Gamermike

Holy fuck.

I'm 99% certain i'm handing my notice in tomorrow. I currently work in a well established 'big' organisation that really sucks on working hours, the pay scale, commuting and the type of work not really being my cuppa. Generally not happy, feel like I'm slogging it to no end etc.

I applied to a junior position somewhere locally last month, basically saying the salary would mean I wouldn't want to apply formally but i'm around for freelance opportunities etc. Got invited for a casual chat last week, the business is a start-up but the guy clearly knows what he's talking about and all went really well. Came away thinking I wish they would offer a higher salary and hire me.

This morning i get an email of a job offer. Same money i'm on now, doing what I love doing, much closer and actually using my skills to grow a new business, could be a really good thing for me. Its risky, but I think the risk will be worth it? Someone tell me i'm not mad.

[Deleted User]

Great stuff Mike.
You aren't mad at all, sometimes you have to take the risks in life.
Congrats.

GooberTheHat

Go for it. Nothing worse than spending the majority of your waking hours in a job you don't enjoy.

HawBawJaws

Sounds good mate. My cynical side says maybe too good, but don't listen to me, I'm jaded by the job market just now.

Of course there's a risk involved, but there's a risk with any new job. You could go to an established business and get sacked after 3 months probation, at least here you'll be able to make an impact right from the start.

And if the business flourishes, you'll have the chance to progress with it; or it'll make you more attractive to the next job you go for.

Whatever you do, congratulations and good luck!

Yossarian

It does sound like a bit of a risk, but one worth taking. Good luck with it.

Gamermike

Cheers dudes, its a genuine risk for sure, any start up is...

Its the progression element thats really leading me to hand my notice in. Last month, I got a 2% pay rise at my current job, and although I was grateful for the bonus, it just highlighted to me that I'm going nowhere fast and there are people sitting around me earning more and doing far less.

I know I can add value to this new business and I think they know that too. They are offering me freelance work until I can start officially.

Now to write a resignation letter... really nervous about handing it in. Theres a 3 month notice period on my contract but I sure as hell don't want to drag it on for that long.

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