The British Politics Thread - The Bear and Badger

Roujin

Funkstain wrote:

Roujin wrote:

I think the plan is for the disaster capitalists in the ERG to make a lot of money. I'm not sure how much thought has been put into anything beyond that, but thanks to dumdum conservative beliefs that an artifical hierarchy is necessary for society to function, they are pre-disposed to defer to authority, it seems to have been quite easy for them to find candidates who would stand during the election under the condition that they would only be given the opportunity to stand if they agreed to tow the party line on every single issue when required to vote.

See normally, my view is this is too simplistic, too conspiracy / cynical (no doubt there are those who want to make disaster capitalism money but). You could accuse me of assuming too much intelligence and strategic thinking in our leaders and their supporters - these guys are supposed to think long term, like cross generations to make sure their power lasts as a legacy. But now I think the "elites" we have are woefully incapable of seeing beyond short term benefit, and it could literally be the case that they see dollar signs in the 6-18 months and fuck all beyond that. The UK: we've even got shit elites

I agree, normally that would be far too reductive for me as well. But like, it's been nearly 5 years now and with the current increasing ramping up of absolute stupidity coming from this government just voting like muppets on a whole load of policies without giving them any proper scrutiny I'm really starting to run low on alternatives.

Funkstain

yes. the new theory for the last few years has been "shit elites" and I'm sticking with it

poprock

Funkstain wrote:

The UK: we've even got shit elites

I think this is all tied up in that basic ‘deference to authority’ thing as well. Our elites aren’t actually our elites any more. This lot defer to whoever has more money and power than they do - the extended Saudi royalty, the Russian oligarchs, the press barons, Zuckerberg and Bezos, etc.

davyK

monkey wrote:

I'm surprised that this has come back tbh. I thought that Boris and co made their decision and that was to cut off NI from mainland UK. The proverbial border down the Irish sea. They lied and said that wasn't what was happening but that seemed to be their choice. So I don't quite know where this has come from. They must have known. If it's a negotiating tactic, it doesn't make sense either. This stuff has never worked with the EU. They say they want something. The UK says the opposite. There's very slight leeway given by the EU while the UK give way almost entirely. The hardball stuff has never worked. The only thing I can think is that the inevitable checks and border problems are now going to get blamed on the EU. They need some sort of drama around trade and Brexit to have happened between the last election and January 2021 to point to say it's the EU's fault and not a problem with the original WA.

The NI protocol did just that. Border checks between GB and NI. That was what the EU needed to ensure its market is protected. Part of the deal. That is written into law to be operative by 1st Jan 2021. This bill is to wreck that.

It's as if the Brexiteers still think the EU will fold. They still think we are too important. The EU can't fold and won't.

acemuzzy

Hard to see how Johnson didn't end up looking like even more of a muppet as time ticks by...

mistercrayon

I wonder what his ambition for being prime minister was?

LarryDavid

mistercrayon wrote:

I wonder what his ambition for being prime minister was?

Shagging, holidays, champagne on an oligarchs yacht, snoozing at no.10, flying a Sopwith Camel like Biggles, parties at Chequers, Churchillian speeches to the nation (LOADS of fist banging), auditioning a sea of blondes for the role of Prime Ministerial aide, more shagging...

... maybe a minor war - squashing some backwards tribe in a former colony or something, nothing too risky ... brave Boris tours the battle site afterwards - smoking a cigar & riding in a tank, giving the 'v for victory' sign...

... crowds of simpletons waving miniature Union Jacks at him as he returns victorious, being PM whilst simultaneously working undercover with MI6 in various Bond-type scenarios ... more shagging, yet more holidays, afternoon nap at no.10 (again) ...

davyK

I can remember either reading this in an article or hearing it in an interview:

Johnson was born in New York so could in theory run for POTUS. At one point in his life he considered it but made the decision that he preferred the idea of being PM and so made that his goal.

The man's blind ambition knows no bounds but I don't believe he has ever looked past just getting the prestige of the position.

I don't think he's an empty vessel - he probably has strong ideas as to what he wants for this country but I don't think he puts it into context or has any thoughts as to its implementation or effects on a population with which he has no empathy.

GooberTheHat

davyK wrote:

I can remember either reading this in an article or hearing it in an interview:

Johnson was born in New York so could in theory run for POTUS. At one point in his life he considered it but made the decision that he preferred the idea of being PM and so made that his goal.

The man's blind ambition knows no bounds but I don't believe he has ever looked past just getting the prestige of the position.

I don't think he's an empty vessel - he probably has strong ideas as to what he wants for this country but I don't think he puts it into context or has any thoughts as its implementation of effects on a population with which he has no empathy.

I think that hits the nail on the head. It's all just a big Estonian bully boy one-up manship. A need to prove he's the best, and PM is the next best thing to being king, so there you go.

His last minute flip on supporting Brexit shows he is a ruthless opportunist that doesn't really care what stance he takes on things, as long as it will advance his position personally.

g.man

poprock wrote:

Funkstain wrote:

The UK: we've even got shit elites

I think this is all tied up in that basic ‘deference to authority’ thing as well. Our elites aren’t actually our elites any more. This lot defer to whoever has more money and power than they do - the extended Saudi royalty, the Russian oligarchs, the press barons, Zuckerberg and Bezos, etc.

RedDave2

I think of him as the middle management guy whose goal is to be top level management, not to actually run the business better but just to be the top guy. He'll switch plans and allegiances and work his way up not by succeeding at his job but by succeeding in the background politics. In this respect, he is somewhat perfectly placed.

AndCallMeCharlie

The tearing down of everything will allow the rise of the super connected tech savvy world superpower, like the Bay Area across the nation
This is the cumdog dream / delusion

djchump

"Failing Grayling" on £100,000 a year for 7 hours' "work" a week - just in case anyone else was wondering why on earth the Tories are fucking up our country:
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/chris-grayling-ports-brexit-ferries_uk_5f625651c5b6ba9eb6e8ab0d

No doubt he has a bunch of other side grifts on as well.

Laughing all the way to the bank while they fuck our country into the bin.

RedDave2

And yet... the first comment to that article is from a lovely Barry Smith who thinks its more important to note that illegal immigrants will be getting money in some form from the state. Wonderful.

b0r1s

I mean... he couldn’t spell illegal and was soon shot down. Think he thought he was on the Daily Mail website.

acemuzzy

Hmm, our PM popping to Italy to visit his Russian paymasters again??

https://www.repubblica.it/esteri/2020/09/20/news/the_mystery_of_boris_johnson_s_trip_to_perugia_-267989244/

monkey

The Government has formally scrapped Theresa May’s plans for a British version of the GPS satellite navigation programme, leading to parts of Whitehall now pushing for the UK to rejoin the EU’s Galileo system

https://twitter.com/shashj/status/1307612213897814017?s=21

I hope none of you like GPS.

monkey

Cummings spent half a billion on a satellite company that didn’t make GPS satellites but it’s definitely Theresa May’s crazy wild plan. She’s renowned for her wildly optimistic technology pushes.

Let’s see how well this ‘Brexit’ business works out that she was pushing so hard in the referendum.

Diluted Dante

If only somrone had told them this was mad at the time.

acemuzzy

It's no biggie though, week just freeze public service (*) pay for another few years to cover it

(*) except MPs, obviously. Can't fund all them children otherwise.

monkey

acemuzzy wrote:

Hmm, our PM popping to Italy to visit his Russian paymasters again??

https://www.repubblica.it/esteri/2020/09/20/news/the_mystery_of_boris_johnson_s_trip_to_perugia_-267989244/

Seems like this was a secret Christening for his sprog.

Not the usual drug-fuelled, booze-addled, black out, wake up next to a pillow of incriminating pictures, bunga bunga, Russian blackmail generating, sexcapade.

monkey

Although not sure why you’d choose a Kremlin kompromat factory for a wholesome occasion like a Christening.

acemuzzy

They've denied it happened at all though? All a bit weird, and hence suss.

Diluted Dante

The Tories have ended the rail franchising system, to be replaced with something or other, at some point.

Whilst not good news in and of itself, as they will still find ways to siphon public funds off to their mates, it may make rail nationalisation easier for Labour to implement.

davyK

I really don't get the railway thing. If it is privatised and the private sector is such a marvellous thing why the fuck to we have to bail it out on top of subsidising the thing year in year out? Make profit - fair enough - but don't come crying when you can't cut it any more. It's why public transport simply should not have been privatised as we can't afford to have these things fail.

If any cunt is still making a profit off that (and I bet they are) they, and whoever commissions them, should be strung up by the balls.

poprock

We spent two weeks last year pitching for the Abellio ScotRail marketing contract, only for them to lose their franchise and cancel the tender before it was awarded. Waste of fucking time and money.

mistercrayon

They played you for sandwiches man.

poprock

Totally did. Us and four other agencies. That’s what bugs me - these things add up. That was 10 weeks of unpaid work across five agencies, let alone the free lunches.

LarryDavid

davyK wrote:

I really don't get the railway thing. If it is privatised and the private sector is such a marvellous thing why the fuck to we have to bail it out on top of subsidising the thing year in year out? Make profit - fair enough - but don't come crying when you can't cut it any more. It's why public transport simply should not have been privatised as we can't afford to have these things fail. If any cunt is still making a profit off that (and I bet they are) they, and whoever commissions them, should be strung up by the balls.

We've 40 years of evidence that privatization doesn't improve services in the least. But it's not politically convenient to accept that, so we carry on down the path of failure.

Being cynical you might assume that this will be an effort to make the public pay for the losses incurred whilst running a rail system operating nowhere near capacity due to covid. I mean there's surely some grift involved, it's the Tories after all, we just haven't discovered what it is yet.

nick_md

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