Little Rogue: A thread about Roguelikes, there will be Rogues, like, innit.
  • This could go in the given up on thread too, but I'm about to bin Rogue Singularity, unfortunately.  It's an into the screen roguelike 3D platformer I discovered on a couple of hidden gems vids to assist with my bargain hunting obsession, and was down to £1.19 last week (90% off its standard price).  It's actually got a lot going for it - the character movement is decent (better than most 3D platformers) and the the freeform route planning approach to the straight ahead stages is good.  I'm a fan of the short assault course set-up, and the rogue element suits it quite well (you retain certain unlocks but each run is randomised).  Undocked performance is a bit iffy though, collision detection on a certain enemy type is way off and the jump pads don't always seem to launch the robot successfully, but I think the main problem is that I made the mistake of starting Astro Bot shortly after starting this so I'm struggling to settle for anything less than GOAT robots.  With regret, I am done, but I had a good couple of hours with it.

  • JonB wrote:
    I seem to be doing this a lot recently - hope no one minds - but linking to a review is quicker than typing out what I reckon: https://wireframe.raspberrypi.org/articles/foregone-review-pleasing-rhythm-plain-design

    The Highlight paragraph is enough for me to be in at half price.  Plus plain is fine by me if the rhythm's there.
  • I'm still a genre novice but I've made mental notes of certain games I like the look of/put them on actual watch lists. Would I like Flinthook, d'ya reckon? It's half price on Switch. I've stuck with the last few rogues I've played for a while, so I'm feeling strong.
  • I found it very punishing when I played it years ago, but I seem to remember something about it getting a balance pass
  • I'm really enjoying it so far, it's reminiscent of ScourgeBringer in many ways. Just about my only complaint at this stage is the hookshot attaching to the wrong thing if I'm aiming at enemies that need hooking first, but that could still prove to be minor. You get a fair amount of health from treasure chests, so I'd imagine it has had some niceness patched in. Movement and shooting is good, plus it looks like the bounties remain unlocked so you don't have to start runs from square one if you beat a proper boss, which is huge for me.

    There are so many good games buried deep in the digital stores.
  • Second boss just killed me with a sliver of life left. Liking this a lot.
  • It's fair to say this has got its...claws in. It's not without its flaws (the fickle hookshot really is an absolute pain unfortunately, and some of the level modifiers are just weird) but the good vastly outweighs the slightly-off. This is my kind of rogue, although I am essentially just grinding for permanent perks to stay in step with the difficulty now. The basics aren't as earth shatteringly perfect as ScourgeBringer but it does play a better game of chance, and despite being very tricky doesn't feel anywhere near as insurmountable. Thanks for the rec, younger Tempy.

    Does anyone know who Chris is? I have one badger on my Switch friend list with scores for this.
  • I don't often get that 'fully in the grip of a rogue' feeling, but it's pretty great huh? I've only managed to see three bosses so far but unlike ScourgeBringer it seems to want to help me to improve rather than help for a while then abruptly put a pair of deal with it glasses on.

    One of the best new old games I've played this year.
  • acemuzzy
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    This is still Flinthook, right? I don't think I knew it was rogue-like. But uh yeah I obviously anyway own it on Steam so uh yeah maybe I should give it a go...
  • Yes. But the same team made Ninja Senki so approach with caution I guess. Was pleased to discover that they're developing the upcoming Ninja Turtles game too.
  • acemuzzy
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    Well I can install it I guess...
  • Given its scratching the itch, have you done the big hitters? Dead cells, hades and I guess Isaac?
    I'm still great and you still love it.
  • The new Isaac update sounds wild, but I didn't get Afterbirth so I am many, many decades of content behind.

    I have been dabbling with Noita recently, which has blown my tiny fucking mind. The scope of the game is UNREAL.
  • Facewon wrote:
    Given its scratching the itch, have you done the big hitters? Dead cells, hades and I guess Isaac?

    Dear Cells yes, I love the basics but find starting from the beginning each time a bit of a chore, even with the perks unlocked along the way. It also feels more random with how kind or unkind each build is.

    Hades I haven't tried yet. I will when the price is low enough to gamble. Slightly put off by the fact that I hated the combat in Transistor but definitely willing to give it a go at some point.

    Isaac I didn't get on with at all, the main weapon felt a bit peashooter-ish to me. Might be worth another look at some point, just to be sure.
  • Hades isn't like transistor at all. The combat is silky smooth action.

    I'd say it borrows most from pyre in a limited way with how the shield and the gun in particular aim. But even then it's a distant cousin.
    I'm still great and you still love it.
  • Main weapon in Isaac is indeed a peashooter, but you really don't stick with it for long. After 20 mins or so you end up firing giant rings of bloodlaser that home in on enemies and spawn killer flies with every hit, or giant tears that fill the screen and one shot bosses. You need to dream a little bigger darling.

    Hades combat is nothing like Transistor, for one there's no pause. Check out one of the many videos I linked in the Thread For It.
  • Hades is the one I'd most like to like. I'm building up to it.
  • Flinthook again. Is 'I can't do this' a regular feeling with roguelikes? Because....I can't do this. Or at least I don't think I can, having had a couple of runs at the 4th stage. It's a different kind of ineffectual feeling to failing at something like Cuphead because success genuinely feels out of my range here. It's taken about 7hrs to get to the final stage, but at least the earlier level sets all felt doable.
  • acemuzzy
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    Git gud m8
  • I know my limits, I might have to pack this in.
  • ScourgeBringer was similarly insane at the end, but that one had a couple of sliders to tinker with to make it more forgiving while you practice.
  • That's roguelikes.
  • It's so difficult.  

    You get 15 perk slots and an ever-increasing abundance of perks to choose from, but the cost of some seems so bizarre to me.  A double jump would be useful for sure, but 9 points of useful compared to say, an increased crit damage mod that costs 1 slot?  I get that this is the thing - juggling loadouts/decisions and whatnot - but it doesn't feel particularly balanced.  A short dash costs 6 points too.  I've beaten the first three bosses but the final run requires me to basically do slightly trickier versions of the initial three sections and bosses again, followed by another boss (two bosses actually, I looked on Youtube), and it's pretty daunting given that you're trying to do the whole thing one energy bar.  It's not the enemies that are doing me in per se, it's the hazards that seem to chip away at my health on any given run (spikes/spike traps are often very tricky to spot on the small screen).  I'm running out of scope to reduce the difficulty in any meaningful way too, there are only two further permahealth upgrades to buy.  /Waffle.  Good game though.
  • General consensus online seems to be learn the pro controls that were patched a while after launch or grind for dozens of hours until you've maxed out the perk pool.  I'm on level 65 after maybe 12hrs, with no success on the Gwarlock run, but you've got people on 30hrs/lvl.100 on Reddit that are still pushing for their first Gwarlock kill.  So I need to decide whether to suppress a dozen hours of muscle memory for twin stick controls or bin it.  

    There's an excellent game trying to get out here but so many irritants are holding it back, it feels like it's one content update away from true greatness, which is infuriating as the last patch arrived in 2017.  This guy sums it up well:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Flinthook/comments/6ev8lh/everything_right_and_wrong_with_flinthook/
  • Hades ordered, let's do this.  It'll have to go some to be as good as Flinthook though.
  • And I also bought 20XX and Exit the Gungeon in recent sales.  Better late than never.
  • If you ended up coming out of Hades thinking Flinthook is better I'll need you to take some kind of test to confirm you aren't a tulpa or something.
  • I can't decide if I'm annoyed or happy about it as I was pretty much resigned to throwing the towel in soon, but I just had my first taste of almost victory in Flinthook. After 20hrs - the last 10 of which I've spent wondering if finishing a full run is out of my reach - I managed to get 11 out of 12 medals, meaning I was a whisker away from the final boss. It takes about a fucking hour to do a full three ship run and it's hideously difficult...but maybe I can do this. Maybe.
  • And there it is, the end of my Flinthook thread spamming. Credits are rolling, I did it!!! Easily one of the most difficult games I've ever finished. Final run took well over an hour because I was playing so cautiously, but it paid off. It also taught me that rogues can beat you down and build you back up during the course of a run - I've often tended to restart if I'm having a mare, but I brought it back from the brink midway through.

    It's a flawed game in many ways but it's my second favourite roguelike for sure.
  • acemuzzy
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    After SB?

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