The British Politics Thread - The Bear and Badger

Unlikely

Ah.

LivDiv

I couldn't give two fucks about Farage but would say that it's a bit close to it in terms of offending actual victims of acid attacks.
Wary of projecting offense.

RedDave2

JonB wrote:

Right-wing snowflakery.

What was it Farage was saying about picking up a rifle not long ago?

It's a thin line. If you found sargon of akkards rape 'joke' a step too far, I don't think it's far to say this doesn't fall under the same line. It's not needed, it plays right into the hands of the right-wing.

And let's be fair, it's not even a funny joke. It's barely a joke.

Roujin

I think it's quite clear that Jo Brand was making a joke and was not inciting people to commit acts of violence against politicians.

I'm with Jon, this is right wing snowflakery of the highest order. They are the first to label complainants as snowflakes when they get called out for their hateful bile spewing and they ate also the first to play the victim card like the little bitches they are.

All this "we should be better" type rhetoric can get in the bin, by virtue of not being a racially divisive group of money driven, deregulated market, corp backed fucktoads "we" already are better than they are, that's why they have to defer to crybaby antics like this if someone says anything close to the bone, because there is no way the actual person on the street will ever side with them if they reveal their actual motivations for why they want the policies they are pushing for.

Yossarian

RedDave2 wrote:

JonB wrote:

Right-wing snowflakery.

What was it Farage was saying about picking up a rifle not long ago?

It's a thin line. If you found sargon of akkards rape 'joke' a step too far, I don't think it's far to say this doesn't fall under the same line. It's not needed, it plays right into the hands of the right-wing.

And let's be fair, it's not even a funny joke. It's barely a joke.

Sargon was running for public office, Brand isn’t. The standards they should be held to are not the same.

RedDave2

So what's the joke then? If its about the over reaction to the milkshakes than why go battery acid which is a legit method of attack?

I don't think it's about being the better side, I think it's about being the better person full stop.

Edit: somewhat a fair point but it doesn't make it any less distasteful.

Roujin

Jo Brand is a better person than Farage even when she's joking about throwing battery acid on people who imo deserve to reap what they've sown.

Yossarian

It was a bad joke, but what we’re seeing here is standard right-wing confected outrage to paint themselves as the victims. It’s utterly textbook. Yes, Brand should apologise assuming she hasn’t already, but anything beyond that is just right-wing figures playing the situation for whatever they can get out of it.

JonB

RedDave2 wrote:

Right-wing snowflakery. What was it Farage was saying about picking up a rifle not long ago?

It's a thin line. If you found sargon of akkards rape 'joke' a step too far, I don't think it's far to say this doesn't fall under the same line. It's not needed, it plays right into the hands of the right-wing. And let's be fair, it's not even a funny joke. It's barely a joke.

It's not a good joke. It's typical Jo Brand humour, really. But no one ever thought to take it seriously before. It's nothing like those rape comments.

LivDiv wrote:

I couldn't give two fucks about Farage but would say that it's a bit close to it in terms of offending actual victims of acid attacks. Wary of projecting offense.

Yeah, I had thought this. The fact that there was that spate of acid attacks not too long ago makes it kinda tasteless.

RedDave2

Yossarian wrote:

It was a bad joke, but what we’re seeing here is standard right-wing confected outrage to paint themselves as the victims. It’s utterly textbook. Yes, Brand should apologise assuming she hasn’t already, but anything beyond that is just right-wing figures playing the situation for whatever they can get out of it.

I certainly agree that maybe all that is needed. I just don't get how people can defend what she said, especially given recent events both in politic events and general crime. Just because others have said the same or worse doesn't let her off the hook.

The quote in full is:
[font=graphik,Arial,sans-serif]Well yes I would say that, but I think that's because certain unpleasant characters are being thrown to the fore and they're very, very easy to hate. [/font]
[font=graphik,Arial,sans-serif]'And I'm kind of thinking, 'why bother with a milkshake when you could get some battery acid?'[/font]
[font=graphik,Arial,sans-serif]'I'm not going to do it, it's purely a fantasy, but I think milkshakes are pathetic, I honestly do, sorry.'[/font]
I don't think there is a joke there to be honest. I don't know whether she should be fired but we are back in the Danny Baker thing and I think he has more of a defense than Brand does to be honest.

And @roujin - I'm assuming you aren't being fully serious but do you really think Farrage deserves an acid attack? Would you applaud if someone did that?

Yossarian

I think the context of the quote makes it even clearer that she’s not advocating violence, TBH.

Also, I’m not sure what she should be fired from, I’m not aware of her having a regular job.

And Baker had no defence, even he admitted that he should have been fired.

Roujin

RedDave2 wrote:

And @roujin - I'm assuming you aren't being fully serious but do you really think Farrage deserves an acid attack? Would you applaud if someone did that?

No, not an acid attack.

I would like him and all other racists, fascists and bigots to feel the fear they have inflicted on others though. Since they are by and large white males, they don't really have to fear much as long as they stay in their own little bubbles. I reckon he'd fear for his life though if thrown to a group made up of the sort of people he wishes he could get rid of.

RedDave2

Yossarian wrote:

I think the context of the quote makes it even clearer that she’s not advocating violence, TBH. Also, I’m not sure what she should be fired from, I’m not aware of her having a regular job. And Baker had no defence, even he admitted that he should have been fired.

Hmm. She's not advocating she causes the violence but you could easily read that as "Hey Guys, up your game, I think milkshakes are pathethic to be honest. Try Battery Acid"

I'm taking the piss with the above a bit I know but regardless of if she apologies, gets fired whatever. I don't think thats the issue I have with it. It's those who are defending her comments that I have the issue with.

I also genuinely think that come the next election run, if the milkshake thing keeps up, someone is going to get shot trying to throw a milkshake by a policeman or security guard who cant take the chance that it might not actually be a milkshake but battery acid. And thats regardless of their politic stances.

Yossarian

Security guards and the majority of the police don’t carry guns. The risk shouldn’t be too high.

LivDiv

Boris Johnson - 114
Jeremy Hunt - 43
Michael Gove - 37
Dominic Raab - 27
Sajid Javid - 23
Matt Hancock - 20
Mark Harper - 10
Rory Stewart - 19
Esther McVey - 9
Andrea Leadsom - 11

LivDiv

Leadsom, McVey and Harper out.
I would imagine Stewart would drop out as well, 17 was the minimum votes required.

monkey

Leadsom, McVey, Mark Harper all out. Rory Stewart keeps the dream alive, squeaking through with 19 votes.
Mark Harper managed to be more anonymous by the time he’d finished than he was when he started.

monkey

Tough to see where Rory Stewart is getting more votes from. Two out of three of the eliminated are wretched no dealers. Mark Harper who knows?

LivDiv

It is all but guaranteed Boris will be in the final two.
Anyone running on the same platform as him should just drop out.

This is now, realistically a battle of who faces Boris in the member vote. Hunt or Gove.

djchump

Bojo, Hunt, and Gove. Wow, that really is a triumvirate of shits.

acemuzzy

Are we going to consecutively have the three worst prime ministers ever?

davyK

Re Jo Brand - who I actually think quite highly of.

There are too many people who excuse what they say as it being a joke. It isn't good enough.

It may be snowflakery but why bring yourself down to that level? All you are doing is giving that type of person ammunition to use against you.

Roujin

Bojo and Gove who both were contenders but melted into the background after Cameron resigned because they didn't want the top job despite leading leave campaigns themselves have now somehow decided that the time is right to lead the country?

It's fucking pathetic really. They both ducked out, let the negotiations die on their arse in the hands of May, Davis et al, and now when they have an opportunity to come back and lead while blaming everything that goes badly on the previous leader, here they are, ready to save the day.

What a couple of prize twats.

davyK

acemuzzy wrote:

Are we going to consecutively have the three worst prime ministers ever?

Looks like it. Couldn't see it being any other way.

And if/when they fuck up it could be Jez for 4-in-a-row.

davyK

The only small hope is if Boris gets in and then realises he's finished if they delivers on the rhetoric (he may already know that) and talks the embittered mass down and into something far better. He's capable enough of doing that if he puts a good team around himself.

LivDiv

Someone needs to check on Rory Stewart.

This is amazing - we’re getting some real momentum here. Thank you so, so much. Let’s push this through to the end. It’s increasingly clear it’s me against Boris. And let’s win

Tempy

he's getting checked into the head trauma unit as we speak

LivDiv

Unlikely

I find him entertainingly demented.

LivDiv

I make it 161-152 split in the Tory party.

161 being the No Deal, suicide squad.
Bojo, Raab, Leadsom, McVey

152 being various alternative solutions from the rest.

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