Let's make a gaming PC - The Bear and Badger

SpaceGazelle

I'm still trying to find out if RTX is actually doing any ray tracing at all. Nvidia are certainly giving the impression it isn't, which isn't outlandish considering that ML chess programs don't calculate any possible future moves at all. If they don't, which seems reasonable, the obscura effect is quite a thing to uncover.

Edit: Ah it does do. Quite a lot actually, via DXR and OptiX.

GurtTractor

hunk wrote:

LivDiv wrote:

Godspeed Hunk

Cheers Livdiv. As expected, the clean install worked out. No weird flickering anymore. Thank God for Rufus and an old spare win10 iso burned to a usb stick. Reinstall took a mere 20-25 mins. The 1903 upgrade defintely breaks my win10 install. The flicker returns as something in win10 hijacks nVidia optimus in my laptop causing unstable recurrent flicker sometimes even building up to bsod's. Uninstalled 1903 and everything runs fine again. Microsoft has definitely lost the plot on windows updates and stability. Unacceptable. Fuck it, if MS keeps throwing shit updates at me like this I might give Linux and Ubuntu another go. Or even SteamOS....

Are you using the latest ISO download from MS? I have a little USB stick retail key version of Win 10, but I always download the latest available ISO to avoid issues with major version updates. You have to do some jiggery pokery to be able to get just the ISO and not the download tool thing, use a user agent switch browser addon to trick the site into thinking you're not using a win 10 system already. Then use Rufus to get the ISO on a USB stick.

hunk

Nope, I used the iso before 1903. After that I used the w10 upgrade tool to upgrade to the latest W10 version. The flickering returned even before the tool was finished lol. And to be honest, I'm not convinced the latest iso will fix it. MS has fucked up big time. I think I'll sit on the older version a bit longer. If this is the new MS they can go do one.

As for only using the latest W10 iso, good point. Perhaps next major upgrade.

GurtTractor

Aye the latest ISO you can download from MS is the May 2019 version, which I think is 1903. I would definitely recommend always using the latest, as the update process to a new major version typically fucks something up.

hunk

Cheers Gurt!
So, finally reposting the laptop. Is it ok to use arctic silver 5 on the Vram? Or should I run out for arctic ceramique?

GurtTractor

Err, it depends on how the VRAM is cooled, usually they have little thermal pads between them and the heatsink, and there are different thicknesses which you will want to match with whatever it came with.

For pastes I pretty much always use Kryonaut -

For low power stuff it will be a minimal difference between pastes tbf, even less if an IHS is involved.

hunk

Ah cheers for that.
The Vram was cooled with thermal gel goop.
I will see if I can find some online.
For thermal paste I still have some arctic silver lying around.

GurtTractor

Aye thermal pads will probably do for them, you just need to make sure the thickness and contact is good.

hunk

Update: Repasted the laptop and guess what, the screen flicker is gone. The old paste was quite hard and crumbly too. If I had delayed the repaste any longer my laptop would've probably melted in due time. It was the Intel integrated CPU/GPU overheating hence the problems mostly occuring in Windows desktop mode.

Also, getting to the innards of a laptop mobo is a bitch. If you're familiar with pc mobo's I guess it shouldn't give you too many problems but for beginners it can be quite tricky.

Also, why is the mobo battery buried deep into the system and inaccessible to the user. I made the mistake of powering on the system without SSD. The bios crashed and I had to reopen the laptop again just to get to the fucking bios battery.

GurtTractor

Yeah, this is why I so often recommend repasting hardware. There must be so many devices that have been consigned to the bin, when they are likely just overheating due to dust and poor thermal contact. And this is why it's so important to get devices that are actually repairable, far too many are near impossible to get into and it really is criminal in terms of the environment and the consumer's right to repair.

My little old Thinkpad X230 has two different types of phillips head screws, and only a couple of dozen of them at most. It's still fiddly but really not too bad to get the whole think apart for maintenance. I remember taking apart a Macbook from 2009, and even though back then they still had the nice RAM upgrade hatch it was a fucking nightmare to get the thing apart, a really unfriendly design.

I recommend making ease of disassembly and repairability a priority when selecting a new mobile computer.

SpaceGazelle

The great thing about PCs is you can give them a spring clean and reseat all the stuff.

It's amazing how reliable they actually are though, with so many different parts. Even for just the motherboard to function so well seems outrageous when you stare at all the bits. And it's a wonder how reliable all those billions of transistors are within the chips. Christ, even an old HDD is sort of jaw dropping. In fact I refuse to believe in them but i'm still going to play Destiny.

hunk

I've never actually broken a pc and that includes laptops. You'd have to use a sledgehammer to permanently put them out of commission.

GurtTractor

It's software that's the real shitter.

hunk

The micro connectors are fiddly and vulnerable. I just wish they were sturdier and standardised. Also, the mobo bios battery should always be accessible. As for the repaste, the pc runs so much quieter and cooler now, The cpu actually idles at about 40C instead of 50-55C.
Should've done this much sooner....

Boolitt

GurtTractor wrote:

Ok here's a list. It is over budget but keep in mind that's all new and there's ways to save a fair bit which I'll go through -

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 3.4 GHz 6-Core Processor (£119.00 @ Amazon UK)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK ATX AM4 Motherboard (£104.98 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Patriot Viper 4 8 GB (2 x 4 GB) DDR4-3000 Memory (£39.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 500 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£70.99 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: MSI Radeon RX 570 8 GB ARMOR OC Video Card (£134.99 @ CCL Computers)
Case: Fractal Design Meshify C ATX Mid Tower Case (£79.99 @ Amazon UK)
Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA G3 (EU) 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (£85.47 @ Scan.co.uk)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit (£89.97 @ Laptops Direct)
Total: £725.38
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2019-08-13 22:23 BST+0100

Any chance you could refresh this parts list Gurt.
I am looking to sort the boy out for xmas and he has saved up £500quid so im happy to put £200 to 300 on top.
Cheers

GurtTractor

NP, gimme a hour or so and I'll have a look.

GurtTractor

Ok here you go -

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 3.4 GHz 6-Core Processor (£106.38 @ Aria PC)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK ATX AM4 Motherboard (£99.95 @ Overclockers.co.uk)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (£66.78 @ Aria PC)
Storage: Samsung 970 Evo Plus 500 GB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£89.87 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon RX 590 8 GB GAMING 8G Video Card (£174.99 @ Box Limited)
Case: Fractal Design Meshify C ATX Mid Tower Case (£89.99 @ Currys PC World)
Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA G3 550 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (£82.40 @ Alza)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit (£85.98 @ Aria PC)
Total: £796.34
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2019-11-04 21:16 GMT+0000

So that is right at the top end of your budget there, but there's some decent performance upgrades there for storage and GPU, and double the RAM. I don't know if you have a monitor and such already or if you need those two, so let me know if you want any tweaks. That's going to be a fantastic machine and platform to start off with, and is nicely upgradable.

Boolitt

Thanks alot. Yeah we have a monitor so no issues there.
Not sure if waiting for black Friday/ cyber Monday is a good idea to maybe save a couple of quid or not.

GurtTractor

Yeah I was thinking about that... It's really tough to know for sure when the right time to buy stuff is. You can get a gauge for how low prices can fall by clicking the product links through to PCPartPicker there and scrolling down to the price history. Very handy. Hotukdeals is useful too.

My thoughts are that I don't think you going to find most of the stuff dramatically cheaper if you hold off. The best bets for good deals would be the graphics card, maybe the motherboard. But for the most of those I doubt that you'll get more than a tenner off the individual price. Factor in the limited supply and the time and stress of jumping on deals and judge whether that seems worthwile too.

Those are all good prices. The CPU seems rock bottom to me, the motherboard I think could drop a tenner, the memory I doubt will get cheaper for that speed, the SSD might drop a tenner, the GPU is a good deal for a 590 but maybe it could drop as much as a 10-15, the case could easily drop a bit, not sure that the power supply will drop much.

So if it were me this is what I would do now: Buy the CPU (not sure if they will run out to clear stock of that previous gen), buy that RAM as memory pricing and supply is very fickle, and that is a nice kit. Really not sure about the GPU, 50/50 on that. The rest I think should stay in stock and either stay the same price or drop slightly.

Hope that helps.

Boolitt

Nice one thanks. I'll let you know how we get on

SpaceGazelle

I have an old i5 3500k paired with a 2070 super. I should probably upgrade the CPU but it handles high end VR just fine. I don't know what my point is.

Boolitt

Right I've purchased most of the gubbins on Gurts list but paid an extra 10 quid for the ryzen 5 2600x for what its worth.
If i need to use wifi primarily for internet connection is it best to go with a proper card or will just a usb adapter be ok?
Only other solution is the tp link plug ins at the moment due to locatkn of the router.
Also are there any other bit n bobs i would need, cables etc, to get this up n running on boxing day with a hangover.

SpaceGazelle

Get a card - cheap and tidy. Obv don't forget to make a bootable USB for Windows but don't buy Windows. The unregistered version is better and it's then easy enough to get rid of the "Activate Windows" watermark in the corner.

Frosty

Boolitt wrote:

Right I've purchased most of the gubbins on Gurts list but paid an extra 10 quid for the ryzen 5 2600x for what its worth.
If i need to use wifi primarily for internet connection is it best to go with a proper card or will just a usb adapter be ok?
Only other solution is the tp link plug ins at the moment due to locatkn of the router.
Also are there any other bit n bobs i would need, cables etc, to get this up n running on boxing day with a hangover.

I bought this one and it's been really good. Its £25

Gigabyte GC-WB1733D-I Wireless-AC PCI-E Network Interface Card + Bluetooth v5.0-1733Mbps https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07FBSV1XZ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_mMRWDb1PAT0P8

SpaceGazelle

And get rid of the watermark using a simple text file (method 2)

https://productkey.net/how-to-remove-activate-windows-10-watermark-2019/

Hodge360

Have they finally stopped giving Windows away for free?

Frosty

If anyone's looking for a NVMe ssd then this seems like a good deal for a 2TB one.

£187 for the next 12 hours.

I'm tempted as I've currently got a 256GB full fat SSD, a 1TB HDD and a super slow 2TB HDD that I store poop on.

Sabrent 2TB Rocket NVMe PCIe M.2 2280 Internal SSD High Performance Solid State Drive (SB-ROCKET-2TB) https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07MTQTNVR/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_5oRXDbX6ZN0J8

GurtTractor

I'm planning on populating the other M.2 slot on my board with a big NVME one of these days, I think if I can put 2TB in there I should be able to relegate my 3TB HDD purely to backup purposes.

If you get it you should consider reinstalling the OS on there, as that should be a bit nippier than the SATA drive.

b0r1s

Question about borked PC’s. My mate has a got a dead laptop that won’t boot up. It’s a cheap £200 job. Amazon said they’d take it back but he’s worried about data on it getting into the wrong hands. He’s also got a desktop PC. Could he hook up the desktop like Apple’s target disk mode to format the laptop drive? His only slight concern is he thinks the laptop is dead due to a virus. Any ideas guys?

LivDiv

Depends what is wrong with it I guess.
They should be able to wipe the hdd from the bios, in fact that could be the most secure way to delete all data.
Best bet is to google "wipe hdd bios" followed by the model number of their laptop.
That will delete the operating system as well though.

Of course if it wont boot to bios or the screen/battery is gone then they cant really do much.
They could swap out the drive but that would likely void any warranty Amazon are adhering to.

If it won't boot at all then I dont think hooking it up to another pc will work as the HDD will still be running through the laptops motherboard and power supply.

It will be quite the virus if it won't boot at all. Most things will boot in safe mode if it is just a software issue.

Howdy, Stranger!

Categories