Fucking routers and modems
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Ok, here are the devices. LAN into blue comes from wall. That's our internet coming in.
LAN going from Yellow in Nokia to Eero is connection between those two. That's been the same from day one.
The Nokia has only 2 LAN ports. So am I removing the Eero and plugging in laptop to make sure of internet connection when in bridge mode? And am I doing that purely to have access to settings of nokia? If that is the case, I think it's moot, as there's no 192.168.etc address for the Nokia. (well, there is, but it doesn't appear to work.) the only access to the Nokia, and the Eero, is through phone apps.I'm still great and you still love it. -
According to Nokia, you set it to bridge mode via the app. I'm not sure how that works.
Were you using 192.168.18.1? -
ffs. Thank you dante.I'm still great and you still love it.
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So, tried bridge mode on Nokia. Just throws an error if you attempt when the LAN cable isnt plugged into eero. For reasons. So I started bridge mode with it plugged into eero. But that seems to make having laptop useless. Because plugging in laptop once it's gone red light doesn't help.
So do I try setting it to bridge mode with LAN cable going to eero from Nokia, then another going from eero to laptop.
Phone app or laptop can't access settings for Nokia anyway.I'm still great and you still love it. -
Two Qs:
1. You set Nokia to bridge mode via app, with nothing plugged in (other than internet cable I assume); and it throws an error? What throws error, what is error? Do you mean the app stops connecting to Nokia and shows error? I’d expect that (though it’s still shit) cos WiFi will be off when in bridge mode
Do you then lan connect in the eero and turn it on?
2. What happens after error and you plug in eero via lan to bridge mode Nokia and turn it on? Anything at all? Can you not connect to eero when you do this?
The issue I think you’re having is either the Nokia is not connecting properly to internet in bridge mode, is not passing through internet connection in bridge mode, or most likely, the eero is not setting itself up properly when receiving the bridged internet connection from Nokia. You’d have to connect to the eero, once it’s connected to the Nokia in bridge mode and switched on powered up and initialised, and ask it what’s happening - this I surely possible with the eero app? -
Is the Eero actually a modem? Or is it just a switch/router?
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Looking at the description on this, it's just a router.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/eero-pro-mesh-wi-fi-system/dp/B07WFJCSYX/ref=asc_df_B07WFJCSYX/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=394377859857&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5090912997695702848&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=20477&hvtargid=pla-838900635030&psc=1&th=1&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=83402308498&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=394377859857&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5090912997695702848&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=20477&hvtargid=pla-838900635030
Which means it won't have any way of authenticating with your ISP. Won't have any PPPoE settings, and things like that.
If that is the case, then the Nokia should not be put in bridge mode at all.
When you say double NAT issues, what exactly is the issue you're having? -
Funk, the error happens when attempting bridge mode. It won't let me go to bridge mode in that instance.
To clarify on the eero for chopper. It's the eero max 6. Mesh. (pack of 3 in this case)
I'm still great and you still love it. -
Double NAT is what the Xbox says is the problem. And it means my NAT is strict. Which has always meant issues. (in this case booting me from Mp games.)
There's help pages about it, but they're all so generic it's infuriating.
There's also help pages on the plex site. Because it also doesn't like double NAT for trying to get remote access working.
But apparently, because there's so many different brands/models etc involved, no one can explain things step by step. Because routers modems, gateways, bridges. Netgear fucking eero fucking Nokia fucking dchp, Nat, upnp, ports, isps, Xbox, MAC address, wan, LAN, ipv6 or 4. DNS. Fuck.I'm still great and you still love it. -
Pretty sure they're not modems, so don't Bridge the Nokia.
"I can't work out how to sort out double NAT issues with both xbox and Plex"
What is the exact issue you're having?
Error messages/codes?
Screenshots where applicable. -
https://support.plex.tv/articles/200931138-troubleshooting-remote-access/
So reading this, there could be a bunch of reasons/solutions. My ISP help desk is fucking useless though.I'm still great and you still love it. -
https://support.xbox.com/en-US/help/hardware-network/connect-network/double-nat-detected
And Xbox says ISP too. Jesus.
I'm still great and you still love it. -
Oddly. I've just done this set-up today with a new router and an Eero network. Here's what I did...
1. My Eero was already set up with my old modem/router, so I switched off Eero, swapped out the old modem/router for the new one. I connected the modem/router to the Eero with an ethernet cable (PlusNet Hub 2) and switched on.
2. Then in order for the Eero to authenticate with my ISP in bridge mode, using the Eero app I went to Network Settings -> ISP Settings -> WAN type and set to PPPoE providing the username and password provided by my ISP. The manual that came with my new hub detailed what these values should be.
3. I logged into router admin and switched on bridge mode.
4. I restarted the Eero network.
Job done. I'm with PlusNet. Depending on your ISP, point 2 might be different. Check this guide...
https://support.eero.com/hc/en-us/articles/360056800392-Most-Common-UK-ISP-s-and-How-to-Set-Up-eero-with-Them
Incidentally, I was using an older hub previously which resulted in double NAT. This is because there was no bridge mode available so I just had to switch WiFi off, which isn't ideal.
If you want a way to check your network for double NAT run this in terminal (Mac) - "traceroute 8.8.8.8". If the first two jumps in the resulting list are private IP addresses (beginning 192.168 probably), then you have double NAT. -
ChopperByrne wrote:Looking at the description on this, it's just a router. https://www.amazon.co.uk/eero-pro-mesh-wi-fi-system/dp/B07WFJCSYX/ref=asc_df_B07WFJCSYX/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=394377859857&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5090912997695702848&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=20477&hvtargid=pla-838900635030&psc=1&th=1&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=83402308498&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=394377859857&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5090912997695702848&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=20477&hvtargid=pla-838900635030 Which means it won't have any way of authenticating with your ISP. Won't have any PPPoE settings, and things like that. If that is the case, then the Nokia should not be put in bridge mode at all. When you say double NAT issues, what exactly is the issue you're having?
?? Putting a router, even if it contains a modem too, into bridge mode only affects the routing. The modem connection to the ISP will continue to work just fine, and the bridged router will simply pass that connection through LAN without any routing. There is no authentication necessary between a router and another router within a WAN/LAN setup, and the authentication between the Nokia and the ISP is done via the Nokia's modem and settings, not any of its router settings, which are all that are affected by bridge mode.
This is how countless at-home mesh wifi systems are created: you take your crappy ISP-provided modem/router, you stick it in bridge mode, you plug in a mesh base station / router, and you connect the other mesh access points to the base station via (usually) 5GHz backhaul channel.
I cannot see how else you would get a normal mesh system to work without a double NAT / double router set up.
I reiterate that the problem is the dual routers both doing network address translations, and one needs to be a simple bridge or removed from the setup. -
ChopperByrne wrote:Pretty sure they're not modems, so don't Bridge the Nokia.
See, this is where I get completely lost. But it sounds like maybe you know more about networking than I do.
I thought that if you put your modem into bridge mode, it’s still working as a modem. It’s just not doing the NAT job or broadcasting any Wi-Fi. It’s connecting to your ISP, with your login details, and ‘bridging’ the incoming signal straight to the next link in the chain - your router. In this case the Eero.
What have I got wrong there?
Edit: Funk says I’m right, not wrong. So now I’m confused. -
drumbeg wrote:Oddly. I've just done this set-up today with a new router and an Eero network. Here's what I did... 1. My Eero was already set up with my old modem/router, so I switched off Eero, swapped out the old modem/router for the new one (PlusNet Hub 2) and switched on. I connected the modem/router to the Eero with an ethernet cable. 2. Then in order for the Eero to authenticate with my ISP in bridge mode, using the Eero app I went to Network Settings -> ISP Settings -> WAN type and set to PPPoE providing the username and password provided by my ISP. The manual that came with my new hub detailed what these values should be. 3. I logged into router admin and switched on bridge mode. 4. I restarted the Eero network. Job done. I'm with PlusNet. Depending on your ISP, point 2 might be different. Check this guide... https://support.eero.com/hc/en-us/articles/360056800392-Most-Common-UK-ISP-s-and-How-to-Set-Up-eero-with-Them
Yes exactly this -
Id just add that depending on whether you are full fibre or just fibre to cabinet, then set-up might be a little different. Something to do with VLAN settings. Just something I read when trying to work it out myself.
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wait no. why would you need to put the auth details into the eero
edit: oh PPPoE right. that sucks. so yeah if you need to have a PPPoE connection you'll need to connect whatever router you're using directly to the ONT / connection, and that means authentication details which apparently you can enter into the Eero. -
Funkstain wrote:wait no. why would you need to put the auth details into the eero
There are different setups with BT - the connection would be either FTTP and FTTC. With FTTP you can also use PPPoE (only for eero 6, eero Pro 6, eero Pro 6E and eero 6+ models) and connect the eero directly to the BT ONT. In order to do that you need to know your PPPoE username and password. You can get those directly from BT. If you encounter any problems with this type of setup, you can always contact eero support.
https://support.eero.com/hc/en-us/articles/9918915235227-Setting-Up-eero-with-BT -
drumbeg wrote:Incidentally, I was using an older hub previously which resulted in double NAT. This is because there was no bridge mode available so I just had to switch WiFi off, which isn't ideal. If you want a way to check your network for double NAT run this in terminal (Mac) - "traceroute 8.8.8.8". If the first two jumps in the resulting list are private IP addresses (beginning 192.168 probably), then you have double NAT.
you can put the Eero into bridge mode apparently, but dunno if that affects the meshing. switching off wifi (as you've probably noticed) won't remove the double routing / NATing happening -
I’m by no means an expert on this stuff, but I do have a similar setup (BT modem into Orbi mesh router).
Face has been trying this all sorts of ways and coming up against issues, so at this point I’d probably try factory resets on all the equipment and start again from scratch. Because fuck knows what all his settings are by now.
Plug the Nokia modem into the wall. Put in the login/auth details for the ISP. Confirm that it has a net connection (by physically plugging in a laptop if need be). Then set the Nokia to bridge mode. After that, connect the Eero and powering it up. Just the one Eero to start with. Get that broadcasting Wi-Fi properly before turning on the other mesh points and pairing them with it. -
yes that. the most recent issue Face has reported however is the inability to put the Nokia into bridge mode. which sort of scuppers the rest of the instructions. to be 100% clear: face has double NAT because he has two routers routing and translating network addresses. it has nothing to do with the ISP.
If he has a 'normal' connection, then theoretically the Nokia in bridge and the Eero as router (no auth details in Eero needed) should work fine
If he has a PPPoE connection, then he'll have to put the Nokia in bridge and use the Eero to authenticate and then it should work fine -
OK OK OK we need to take a few steps back here.
Firstly: the Nokia Beacon is a mesh router already. But it is not an ONT / modem. Which, OK, I should have looked it up before now sorry.
What this means is: you are already plugging the Beacon into a modem or ONT (optical network terminal, for if you have FTTP), correct? -
(I'm going to go ahead and guess the rest: yes, face is plugging the beacon into some other device. Possibly something like this, if it's still Nokia: https://www.nokia.com/networks/fixed-networks/fiber-ont/)
(and so what Face is trying to do is use one mesh router (from Nokia) and then another mesh router behind it (from Eero)
(my current suspicion therefore is all he needs to do is plug the Eero directly into whatever gateway / modem / ONT was provided by his ISP, and it'll either plugn play work, or he'll need his ISP credentials and enter them into the Eero app, and he's done)
(the moral of the story: you only need one mesh router per mesh network you crazy kid) -
Funkstain wrote:switching off wifi (as you've probably noticed) won't remove the double routing / NATing happening
Yeah, so I only noticed the double-NAT issue after switching off the Wifi (by running traceroute).
I might try switching WAN type back to DHCP (not PPPoE) just to see if the config still works. -
Last thing Face: gimme your ISP details (company and connection type, either FTTP or FTTC I'm assuming), and then I can figure out if they're PPPoE, something funky like IPoE (MER for hardware auth), or just straight DHCP like most right-thinking providers and we can clear this up
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YES! This answers everything. Shit. It’s exactly the same as my setup. Probably fibre to the property, and the wall box is already your modem. Not the Nokia thing.
So ditch the Nokia thing and plug your Eero straight into the wall. If it doesn’t ‘just work’ then you need to put the ISP login/auth details into the Eero. -
poprock wrote:YES! This answers everything. Shit. It’s exactly the same as my setup. Probably fibre to the property, and the wall box is already your modem. Not the Nokia thing. So ditch the Nokia thing and plug your Eero straight into the wall. If it doesn’t ‘just work’ then you need to put the ISP login/auth details into the Eero.
yep. probably should've looked up the Nokia thing first before assuming it was a gateway as well as router. oops sorry Face -
Funkstain wrote:wait no. why would you need to put the auth details into the eero edit: oh PPPoE right. that sucks. so yeah if you need to have a PPPoE connection you'll need to connect whatever router you're using directly to the ONT / connection, and that means authentication details which apparently you can enter into the Eero.
Just to clarify my understanding a little more. I think in my case, switching the hub into bridge mode means it acts purely as a modem and wont even do the ISP authentication (even though I can see the credentials stored within the hub settings). So, the Eero needs the credentials because it takes on the responsibility of doing the authentication itself. -
That's a PPPoE encapsulation thing, yes. Not all ISPs require you to authenticate and connect your 'first router' in the system like that - many (like mine, Community Fibre) support IP over DHCP which is basically plug and play once you get past the ONT
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