Museums have a role in education*. Getting the message in at the start - with kids - that's the only real way anything changes wrt attitudes which is the core issue with racism.

That can be physical and digital - I think we need both and have them complementary.



*That and developing critical thought of course - but that's another story.

Tbh they should start by educating adults about racism, the kids seem to have no problem accepting each other these days, until they have their opinions informed by the ignorance displayed by their elders.

Roujin wrote:

Tbh they should start by educating adults about racism, the kids seem to have no problem accepting each other these days, until they have their opinions informed by the ignorance displayed by their elders.

Im not sure. Adults are more entrenched in their ideas, kids are generally more open to new ideas.

It probably needs a concerted effort for both. I think a start might be not to attribute blame but simply state the facts. White people (myself included I must admit) can feel very defensive about this, especially if they themselves have never been knowingly racist (not saying their isn't a subconscious racism). I think that's were much of the push back in the US comes with the BLM, telling poor white folk that America is holding down the black people and shouldn't all white people accept their massive privelage is a hard sell.

Evidence like that photo from the previous page is a great education - just reading the story would enlighten and humble the reader if they are white. As Brooks said, it doesn't need the "I'm in tears drama", the story does enough.similar to the story in black klansman. The story of the lynching silenced a whole Irish cinema of white people when I went to see it. It made you think hard on things without pointing a finger.

There's a lot of thick people too, my uncle's in a motorbike fb group so I get a glimpse into comments from them, one today was something like, 'slavery wus generations ago an these slaveries yes ws badbut they also done universities built are cities and all other thiings these snowflake generation forgets.it was whites wot abloished slaveries'

My uncle himself is fine but the folk that comment on his posts, jesus fuck. You can't get those people to even understand that racism doesn't need to be overt, they see slavery as ended so job done.

Ending racism has to start with education in schools about our colonial past and that includes slavery.
The reason why it hasn't been done before is a combination of ignorance, colonialist pride and fear of migrant revolt a la BLM. The strategy of let sleeping dogs lie.

Well the dogs are awake. What now?

Some people I know have no concept of white privilege. They're getting to understand some of this now but it's been a huge wake up call for some people. I've seen a lot of comments on fb from people I barely know, and i've had to delete a couple of people who were lost causes but the others i've tried my best to educate as well as I can but i'm no where near articulate enough (or knowledgeable enough). It's not something you can instantly. And i've no idea how you reverse something which is so systemic.

My family and friends were amused by how so few Black and Asian people were actually involved in tearing down the Colston statue, or defacing the Churchill one. 

Tells you a great deal in itself.

I guess it says many more white people are involved with blm and racial protests than in the past. That's arguably a good thing as institutionalised racism tends to respond better/more lenient to white people protesting.

Sounds like a contradiction but....it is what it is. If you want to generate change you need that wider shift in public opinion. In the west that means the general support of white people. If it were just a black rally and the police clamped down on them with teargas and batons noone would've batted an eyelid. Just like 50 years prior.

Throw in white people in the mix and politicians start getting nervous.

Shame we can’t just give these statues a new head or something and collectively agree it’s depicting someone else.

My guess is that whatever installation replaces these will be aesthetically shitter

Does this work?

I went to the Simpson wiki in the end!

I think Netflix or BBC go:

Is it worth the hassle of keeping this here?

As I mentioned earlier in the thread, that Gone With the Wind has only been removed temporarily, it will be coming back when they can link it to something educational.

The guy person brought up the idea of removing it from their rotation righ tnow was John Ridley, the screenwriter of 12 Years a Slave, he wrote an Op-Ed in the LA Times.

Think this paragraph clears up his view pretty well:

Let me be real clear: I don’t believe in censorship. I don’t think “Gone With the Wind” should be relegated to a vault in Burbank. I would just ask, after a respectful amount of time has passed, that the film be re-introduced to the HBO Max platform along with other films that give a more broad-based and complete picture of what slavery and the Confederacy truly were. Or, perhaps it could be paired with conversations about narratives and why it’s important to have many voices sharing stories from different perspectives rather than merely those reinforcing the views of the prevailing culture.

Culture evolves, representation evolves, discourse allows new voices to be heard, and new opinions to be aired. What was OK yesterday may not be OK tomorrow. Streaming platforms that don't consider themselves archivist really only have capital to answer to. Considering the current flashpoint in America, I really can't see any problem with Ridley's view point, what he's suggested, or how HBO Max have responded. I can see an issue with how it has been reported, word of mouth afterwards.

mistercrayon wrote:

I think Netflix or BBC go: Is it worth the hassle of keeping this here?

Yeah, fair enough. But what about when its something that Netflix or BBC wants to keep but some people find offence. IN the same instances like this statue - how do you ask for something to be removed, can others oppose it etc.

Its not so much a big issue for a thing like Netflix but TV shows, Music etc. are all part of history and culture. So its a bit more of an issue for BBC to 'cancel' something. I'm not defending Little Britain - I thought it had a few good jokes alright but it did have a nasty sneering vibe which I'm not a fan of. But thats not the issue. I suppose the question is removing something from a BBC archive like iPlayer a good thing in that it might offend people (but did it actually - did anyone complain to netflix or BBC) or is it a way for the BBC in particular to hide something it made great profit off but now looks back and thinks it might be better if people forgot about it being a BBC thing.

Also, there is an issue of things disappearing. I'm still pissed Outrun 2 isnt available anymore and I'm guessing something like Little Britain had much more cultural impact.

davyK wrote:

That makes perfect sense to me.  And as was said earlier - the Tom and Jerry cartoons have been put into context on the disc releases. It's the sort of thing we will be seeing more of now and it's fair to say it's been late in coming.

True that, I remember getting hold of "Coal Black and Snow White", and wow it was pretty shocking. Didn't legitimise racism to me, had the complete opposite effect, but then I saw it years after in an environment where it was alien. The issues lie with the more subtle, innocent, and ignorant examples