tigerswiftly wrote:

Despite only giving SFxT a brief run, the idea that it's more "beginner friendly" than SSF4 is utterly fucking ludicrous IMO. Edge were talking some next level nonsense when they said that, I'm sure.

I took the Edge review to mean that SFxT has more options and training stuff to ease a beginner into the game, something SF4 didn't do, as opposed to the game mechanically being easier to get into.

SFxTek has far less that's difficult to do than AE. You guys are confusing more mechanics with higher execution barrier.

The inputs and general execution is piss in SFxTekken compared to AE. Tagging, cross arts and cross assault mechanics are not hard to learn to use for new people. Unlike say FADC in SF.

Well that was awesome, cheers to dubs and nick.

It was like having my very own Mr Miagi and that bearded dude from Kill Bill in all in one.

Gonna take my two moves online now and FUCK SOME SHIT UP!!!

Gotta sort my mic out for the stick though. dunno what the hell's happening there.

My Street Fighter IV days were preceded by a Tekken 5: Dark Resurrection full of friendly beginners. It was one of the few online-enabled PS3 games in 2007, and it was cheap. The problem with fighting games now is that they've tanked up on skilled players over those five years.

I wasn't particularly good at Tekken 5 for a long time, it just crept under my skin as I began to really enjoy improving my tactics. I thought it was casual fun until I found myself thinking about stuff when I wasn't playing.

All I'd say in terms of recommendation is that SF IV is deceptively complex. Being easier to pick up than many is often the eventual undoing of a happy friendship when you can't understand why visual Bill Oddities repeatedly occur. It's all there in the frames and hitboxes, but that calls for an investment not explicitly requested by in-game events.

When I learnt a bit about frames (execution time of move elements) in Tekken it was very 'Ah, well that makes sense'. I didn't need to know most of it because Tekken's pretty face-value; fast moves are fast... Some have good priority against other moves, while some don't. All comes out in the wash.

For every online game, the most important thing is its community. Sprite-based fighters have less backroom frame-diddling than the so-called 2.5D Street Fighter IV and Marvel 3. Not that I'm down on IV, and it is fairly straightforward to learn up until its final furlong. All fighting games are much less aggro with live help from local types. If only to confirm that X beats Y as you go along.

[edit]

To be clearer about frames, they're not especially important. All I was driving at is that frames can explain why certain moves are good or bad contrary to their visual appearance. I do think 3D games are more transparent in this regard owing to their slower gameplay giving your eyes more time to 'see'.

I'm not confusing anything, Roujin. I also disagree, but I'm not going to bother arguing the point.

Swirl, that's because nobody gives a fuck about Go.

Roujin wrote:

SFxTek has far less that's difficult to do than AE. You guys are confusing more mechanics with higher execution barrier. The inputs and general execution is piss in SFxTekken compared to AE. Tagging, cross arts and cross assault mechanics are not hard to learn to use for new people. Unlike say FADC in SF.

I agree with that.

You've got to respect Capcom for attempting to create a throwback to the Alpha games... You know... jump in and give the opponent a fucking good kicking before one can get their shit together. 

It's nothing like the whole SF4 "know thy opponent" craftwork stuff, which might not be for everyone. Or Marvel vs Capcom, which looks all childlike and enticing until you realise that the object of the game is to NEVER fuck up. 

Ever.

So yeah, SFxT is refreshing, because (whisper it quietly) it is a genuine pleasure to play... It feels satisfying, and it's not a badger to learn. And much like Tekken 6, when you get beaten (even by scrub/poor players), you don't feel the frustration as much...

But there are so many fundamental design/technical flaws in SFxT that it presents a completely different barrier to entry...

One that actually has very little to do with the game itself, and more to do with how (and perhaps even, why...) the game was produced... 

That's why I don't have a copy*. 

*That said, I've been playing games a lot less recently. : |

GO GET 'EM MURPHY!

Who wants some? My Rolento will fuck you up.

Yeah good stuff man, nice to see ya.

That beer was just disappearing, definitely affected our game but we did ok. I like your SF2 style of play, as you say just a couple of SF4 tweaks to the repertoire and you'll hold your own in any scenario.

Cheery Pez is up for another meet soon - check in with us at MM.com.

Hey man, feel free to add me on xbox I'm MM nickfullspec

Maybe you could get some games with JRPC, as he's levelling up too at the moment.

On an unrelated tip. Sometimes, the stuff that happens online in this really pisses me off. I'm not talking about the actual game - last night I was playing player matches with someone, winning maybe 80% of the matches, and I could tell he was getting a bit frustrated - you know when someone blames x/y/z instead of acknowleging that you're paying well? I didn't really mind that, whatever, but then a 'known' player joins the lobby. Straight away there was no chat coming my way - to be fair these two people know each other - but being a fifth wheel isn't fun, so I turn off my mic. Anyway I beat this guy and I can hear the salt coming through the t.v "fucking ken wahh wahh mashing wahh wahh". I get a text from the guy I'm playing with "where's your mic". Me - "on the table", I play a couple more and leave.

This kind of thing is the exception rather than the rule, but fuck online serioulsy.

Not worth it. Dragon Punch speaks louder than words.

Especially when you're mashing it out during their combos amiright! *jokes*

Seriously though, I pulled out my fight stick to have a bash on SF4 Super as a rest from Trials Evo. Managed to get Goukens last trial, which I was very pleased with myself for, but ideally I'd like to start playing some friendly matches against people of a similar skill level (poor) instead of bashing my head against the later challenges. Is anyone still playing?

MK, sorry I didn't reply to yer text, read it before going back to sleep Sunday afternoon and then totally forgot about it. Would defo be up for some games at Nick's in the future.

I think the whole SFxT thing comes down to there being so much more to do in it to win, but to do it is relatively easy to execute. Where as SFIV on the whoel is a much simpler beast but those simple things take a fuck load of work to get down reliably (See Rose's only bread and butter: cr.lp, cr.lk, cr.mpxx lk Spiral. Partly my fat hands and trainign room boredom means that well over  ayear later i still have difficulty landing it very reliably offline and hardly ever on. The one frame link right in the middle is a total ass).

That and how much you can get off a jab. SFxT and Marvel chains mean one single hit confirm can mean a big lead, linking anything reliable and damaging off a single jab in AE takes a lot more effort because sooner rather than later a one framer or two will come along and fuck up your day.

Myeh, SFxT could have been a load of fun, just really hoping they got all the bullshit out of their system for Darksatlkers 4. I shall not be holding my icy Sasquatch breath though...

its weird how dev teams must know that the out and out most important thing about any fighting game is a sense of balance. Yet they end up anything but. Longer beta tests wouldn't go amiss.

Darkstalkers 4, you say?? Give us CvSNK 3 you fucking cunts!