Work - The pros and the cons... - The Bear and Badger

three1ne

So who's idea was it to offer you the junior position? A bit embarrassing for the directors if they're genuinely still mulling over your package for team leader/senior role.

poprock

Just a lack of communication. One of their senior designers took it upon himself to grab CVs from their stack of recent job applicants and look for people who could do the temp role. Bit embarrassing for him if I end up being his boss a month from now, but otherwise no harm done.

[Deleted User]

Oh, that's not too bad. I was going to say it would be a bit insulting offering you a junior role while they buggered about.
Get the senior to buy you a pint when you start and it will all be forgotten. Or constantly brought up to take the piss

afgavinstan

No email confirming the second interview yet. Hate this waiting game. I've seen the other side of the fence and now my already dwindling motivation for hmGav is decreasing super rapid. I'm getting annoyed and ratty. Just want out tbh.

poprock

I think that’s always the case Gav. As soon as you look elsewhere, you’ve mentally left the building.

Gamermike

I handed in my notice nearly 6 weeks ago now (3 months notice), and laughably still haven't got a confirmed leave date. HR have timidly said that the latest date would be end of May but its now up to the studio manager to decide whether I can leave earlier than that. I genuinely feel that nobody has a clue what they are doing.

Thankfully new job are happy to pump work my way for freelancing in my own time, which has been really good for much needed extra cash. Going out with them all tomorrow evening to celebrate achieving a company milestone so at least i can get to know some of them a bit better before i start properly.

afgavinstan

Still waiting. That's been a week since I was told they'd "sort out an interview for me tomorrow".

Sent another email today asking what's up. No reply. No answer when I call either. FFS.

Unlikely

There's often internal red tape to cut through with larger companies, so don't be too disheartened. There may be a genuine intent to bring you on board at the branch level, but fuckmuppets higher up won't necessarily see any great hurry to sort it out.

HawBawJaws

(long post warning)

So, got a disciplinary tomorrow.

While back, i was signed off with stress. While I was off, it was decided that i hadn't achieved all the points in my appraisal from last year. Usually, we get a review, and can argue our case as to whether we've achieved or not, I didn't get that chance. Was told i had no grounds for appeal either. The manager that decided this didn't even appraise me herself, was all based on feedback from another manager equal in rank to me. For the last quarter of last year, i was papped offsite to the imax.

I was put on a performance improvement plan as a result. At the pip review, it was again decided i hadn't achieved, and would face disciplinary action. Part of the pip was to take over health and safety. The previous h&s manager was my dgm, the one that didn't manage me at all last year. In the 4 weeks between the pip being issued and the review, we had 1 and a half shifts together for a handover. On the half shift, she hid on our VIP level abd purposely avoided me. On the next, she phoned in sick. Wasn't until the review day i had a chance to go through it with her, which by then was too late.

In the pip, there's a bit against each section called 'support agreed'. No support was agreed, or even offered. Our performance improvement policy states that regular meetings will be held in order to discuss my progress. That didn't happen. I was never given a copy of the relevant policy, and I'm still unsure how it's being considered, ie conduct, gross misconduct etc.

Furthermore, i object to being on it in the first place. While signed off with stress, they made a decision that's further exacerbated it all, I'm not sleeping, and panic attacks have started again. No support or counseling was offered. In fact, while I was off, my boss attempted to pressure me to come back before my line was expired.

I admit i didn't tick every box in the pip. But when it was issued, they basically said if you don't get it now, it'll go on the next one, no mention of disciplinary action was made clear. And zero support was agreed or offered. They've not carried out an investigation either, but apparently the review meeting can constitute an investigation, again, not made clear to me.

I'm convinced the outcome has already been decided, I'm expecting a first written. But i think i can appeal it, based mainly on the fact they've not applied the performance management process correctly.

Thoughts?

GooberTheHat

They sound like a bunch of cunts. Also I would be looking to collect evidence for a constructive dismissal case.

[Deleted User]

I was put on a performance improvement plan as a result. At the pip review, it was again decided i hadn't achieved, and would face disciplinary action. Part of the pip was to take over health and safety.

Extra responsibility is NOT the purpose of an improvement plan. If they think you are struggling with your current responsibilities how the fuck is having more going to help. Especially when it is something very important like H&S, that could endanger customers and staff. Even more so when you have been signed off with stress.

Goober is correct. Get on to citizens advice. Make sure to go and see your GP about your stress, don't forget to look after yourself first and foremost.

Diluted Dante

I would put in a grievance if I were you. I'll see if I can you some advice on that.

Yossarian

GooberTheHat wrote:

They sound like a bunch of cunts. Also I would be looking to collect evidence for a constructive dismissal case.

M0stly harm13ss

You are correct. Whatever the outcome of this meeting, you can appeal it, as no part of the process has been followed correctly. However (and this isn't an issue, it just helps your case in the future), you have to be more proactive managing your own PiP. If you don't get a copy of the policy, raise it in an email, then you have evidence, if the method by which the policy is being applied isn't formally explained, raise it in an email, if you don't have the opportunity to meet a target due to no handover,raise it in an email ( or if it looks like you can't achieve due to issues beyond your control, raise it in an email). Etc

At this point you need to be organised. So write down the issues with the process in order.
A) not provided with the policy

application of the policy and pip, and consequences not explained in a formal meeting.
C) target management meetings not held or results recorded
D) not supported to achieve all the targets set
E) proof that your illness is being taken into account
Etc.

But also, look for a bargaining point. Along the lines of "look, this hasn't worked out due to process not being followed, and me not really knowing how to achieve some targets. Can we just start again, do everything properly and help me achieve,etc, etc,"

And good luck. Sorry they are a bunch of twats..

M0stly harm13ss

Also, pretty sure you have to pay your own costs at an employment trib. these days (which are reimbursed if you win), so best to sort stuff out before that point.

Escape

Management increasingly seems to be a job where conjuring up punitive new rules that define others' jobs is the job.

[Deleted User]

I am convinced there is a lot of people in this country who just say/do stuff to ensure their job is still actually worthwhile.
The amount of clients I have who seemingly make changes to projects for the hell of it is staggering.

Tempy

Escape wrote:

Management increasingly seems to be a job where conjuring up punitive new rules that define others' jobs is the job.

Can't recall if I have said it here but upper management at my job often make up stuff for us to do when we aren't busy. It's always useless stuff that does nothing but take up our time.

Escape

I like the cut of their jib!

HawBawJaws

Thanks guys. Me and the guy that's coming as my companion are usually the go to guys for disciplinaries, so between the two of us we should be able to demolish the process that's been applied.

Just wish I could find another job and get to fuck out the place, don't need all this shite. It's stressing my mrs right out which makes me feel like an utter cunt, given she's preggers.

I'll keep you posted.

[Deleted User]

Best of luck mate.
Yeah keep on looking elsewhere, don't let the cunts drag you down.

ShabbyMcCrabby

Do you actually have targets for customers at a cinema? Is that like candy bar sales and stuff? I always hated having targets related to things that are largely outside of your control or require pressuring the customer to get (pushing upsizing etc).

Surely customer throughput is largely about the quality (or public desirability) of the movies out at the time.

Anyway, good luck HawBaw. I hope you get some positive outcomes.

Skerret

ShabbyMcCrabby wrote:

positive outcomes.

lol

HawBawJaws

ShabbyMcCrabby wrote:

Do you actually have targets for customers at a cinema? Is that like candy bar sales and stuff? I always hated having targets related to things that are largely outside of your control or require pressuring the customer to get (pushing upsizing etc).

Surely customer throughput is largely about the quality (or public desirability) of the movies out at the time.

Anyway, good luck HawBaw. I hope you get some positive outcomes.

Oh aye, targets aplenty. The staff are targeted on things like upselling, we had a 2 for £5 offer recently, they were targeted for that, just now there's an incentive for selling loyalty cards. Managers are targeted on things like controllable costs, staff engagement and turnover, and achieving the points on our appraisals. If we meet our forecasts for the year and tick all the appraisal boxes it's a bigger bonus, also increases/decreases based on how your region performs, and how the company as a whole performs.

Unless you're head office, in which case you get a bonus anyway.

Bollockoff

Skerret wrote:

ShabbyMcCrabby wrote:

positive outcomes.

lol

Calm down. He obviously meant enhanced favourables.

afgavinstan

Interview now happening May 5th. He's called it a "second round" interview even though it's a interview for a different branch to the one I went for a couple of weeks ago. I'm confused. Is it a second round for Sauchiehall St? Or is it for Union St like he said last week, which would be my first for that branch?

I dunno, just get me the fuck outta HMV. Bit of a major fuck up in their pay to me over the course of a few months and that's them now taken it all back. Bread and water for the foreseeable. Just great.

[Deleted User]

Sounds like a second round interview regardless of location. Not a lot of point doing a first round again for a different store.

mistercrayon

They might have separate interviews an s decided you were good enough to bypass the initial sifting one.

HawBawJaws

So........

Disciplinary currently adjourned until i come back from holiday. Guy they sent from dundee was hopelessly unprepared, was almost comical. Me and my companion utterly demolished every point he made, and pointed out the breaches in policy so far, and some of the beaches that occurred today. My buddy had to leave at 7 to go get his wee boy, so it's on hold for now.

I still fully expect a 1st written, but all the holes in the process that's been applied so far mean that it should get laughed out of an appeal hearing. If he's any sense, he'll consult hr in the meantime, who should, if they've any sense, tell him to sack it.

HawBawJaws

Oh, and in more positive news: been offered an interview on Thursday, think I'll cancel though as it's too much of a drop in salary. But after the knocks I've taken recently, just being offered an interview cheers me up. I also found out I'm through to the final round of recruitment for the Virgin media installer job, should be in the next few weeks. Of all the jobs I've applied for recently, this one appeals the most.

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