Society's Ills - A study in the perceived inequalities between the "haves" and the "have nots"
  • Gonzo wrote:
    I go to Starbucks sometimes, the tax avoiding cunts, because their filter coffee is 1.50 and I can ask for a refill, which I do without fail, and because it am has free wifi. The problem is that there is usually a queue, and few seats. As I wait in the queue, by myself, I often see some cunt come in with his friend, join the queue behind me, while his friend goes to sit at a table. This never fails to send me up in arms, and depending on my mood, to start staring at teh fucking cunt, occasionally muttering words to that effect. It's not fair: I joined the queue, I should get the seat. The other day I went into Starbucks with a friend, and I immediately told him to grab a seat. This, I realised, made me a hypocrite I suppose, but given the general behaviour, it was the best course of action to take. I didn't rationalise this and say "single ozno, what a lazy moaning fuckwit he is. He's totally wrong, it's perfectly okay to take a seat when there's 2+ of us". No, morally, normatively, ideally, single ozno is right. But accompanied ozno should not fail to take the opportunity to take a fucking seat, because the way things are set up, it's sit or be, erm, not seated. The moral of which is, if you feel you're successful, have a bit of empathy and take a wider view, don't succumb to facile, self-reassuring dogmas designed to keep the status quo ante, like "anyone can achieve anything if they only try". It's not true. And if you feel you're not successful, don't just refuse to play the game. Try, shift, graft, struggle. Move out of london and commute, fuck off to singapour and earn stacks of dolla. Just don't forget how you felt when you felt there was no way in, and instead of your typical "I made it, fuck y'all lazy bitch nigas" attitude, recall how rigged the game is and the imperative to make it fairer. I will never feel it is fair that some smug cunt has taken my table. But I will, so help me Allah, not fail to avail myself of one if I can. Until the very system changes, what can I do. Hence my position on Elmlea's job. A man's living is a man's living. You gotta do what you gotta do. Unless and until we all get together and demand, indeed create, something better, I will never hear otherwise. But don't be a mug, don't lie to yourself or others. It doesn't make the system any fairer that you succeeded. And it doesn't make your lack of success any less your responsibility that the game is rigged. SORTED YO

    Post of the thread, probably. Brooks has cumulative points for consistent pertinence.

    I know it's turned into a UK specific thing, but I'm pretty sure it has to factor in the globe. If the system sucks because of inequality between the rich and poor in the UK, when you factor in the rest of the world, and start doing the maths on power/wealth inequality globally, surely "try harder" is put to rest? Or am I being overly hopeful.

    Just started Smile or Die: How Positive Thinking Fooled America and the World. I'm lead to believe it does a great job of ass fucking the idea of "if you only try harder. . ." amongst other things. Looking forward to getting stuck in.

    I think it's a complete cop out to point to people's personal circumstances as soon as they question things as they stand, and tbh, I think it's a mistake to use personal experience/circumstance to try and make the point as well.

    If I use myself as an example (or, come to that, us as a collective) it kinda ignores that I'm (we're) probably part of a minority that are relatively well off, compared to the majority of humanity.

    Anyhoo.
    I'm still great and you still love it.
  • Average wage in Nodnol is £34k, yo.

    I couldn't get a job in Newcastle, I moved to Manchester, then to Bristol. Most of my mates now live in London.

    People move for work. Always have done.
  • I would rather live in a society where nobody has to commute hours each day for some soul-destroying Mcjob; working 5 days per week with virtually nothing left over once the essential costs of living are met. We're a long way from this, granted, but we're not even making attempts to steer the ship in the right direction. Quite the opposite in fact. I'd guess that 90% of society's ills are directly traceable to our collective accommodation of one man's right to seize all he can for himself. It's shit.
  • These 'it's all about hard work' arguments only work on an individual level. They can only be backed up by anecdote. Which is why it's so mental to use them in a macro economic argument. 

    Yes Yoss could pursue work in a more lucrative field, maybe one day earn enough to get this house. But the houses are expensive because they're in a desirable area, lots of people want to live there. If everyone who wanted a house there could somehow get together the money, the price of the houses would simply keep rising beyond their level to buy one. They're always competing with people with more money.

    At the end of the day, the person with the least money is missing out. It's just not a coherent solution to soaring house prices to say to people priced out that they should work harder, get a better job.
  • Read a good article a while back about the problem with framing dealing with cancer as a battle to be won or lost as a bit shit, because it implies that those that "beat" cancer did so through some positive thinking and because they tried. obviously implicit in that is that those that die didn't try hard enough.

    Analogy isn't perfect with what we're discussing, but it's close enough for my liking.
    I'm still great and you still love it.
  • Those who 'fight' have almost precisely the same survival rates as those who give up.
  • Well I know global warming is a hoax because I'm cold right now
  • Nobody has to commute hours for a mcjob. They choose to. They could move somewhere else.

    Anyone living in London has to weigh up the disadvantages - high prices, overcrowding, whatever - with the advantages - it's fucking London after all.
  • Bollockoff
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    If anyone needs a break there's some tits in the Sins thread.
  • Yossarian
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    There're a couple in here as well.

    Sorry, couldn't resist the easy joke.

    Edit: beaten to it.
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    But it's where Yoss grew up. And assuming his friends and family haven't been scattered to the wind through this "can't afford here any more? tough shit, try Bradford" policy that's where they are too.
  • I've got a lot to say, but I'm on my iPod so it can wait until later.

    I get paid a 7 figure salary, fwiw. I am a millionaire. Just wanted to point that out. Go me.
  • Actually, I don't have much to say at all. But, hey.

    I actually agree with a lot of what Griff says, albeit in broad brushstrokes. I think there are a lot of people in this world who expect things to come to them with fairly minimal effort and the reality is that it doesn't; people get what they get by hunting it down. Luck is certainly involved, but I'd say the notion that you make your own luck has some traction. But there is absolutely no truth in the idea that anyone can achieve financially as long as they put their heart into their work. It's bullshit. Life isn't like that and to think it is is moronic.

    The wealth gap in Korea makes much difference in terms of educational opportunities which in turn make much difference in terms of who works for the MegaCorps. Private schools in the UK have nothing on this shit.
  • Skerret
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    I've got a lot to say, but I'm on my iPod so it can wait until later. I get paid a 7 figure salary, fwiw. I am a millionaire. Just wanted to point that out. Go me.
    What. The. Fuck.

    Unrelated, ignore me.  I think I've been punk'd.
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • Skerret wrote:
    I've got a lot to say, but I'm on my iPod so it can wait until later. I get paid a 7 figure salary, fwiw. I am a millionaire. Just wanted to point that out. Go me.
    NOTHING.
    ...

    yes?
  • Skerret
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    Er, never mind.  

    PANIC

    going mental, down the tube, ooh it's lovely and grey down here...
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • Skerret
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    I don't care for economics and am therefore unaffected.  Right?
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • YOUR SECRETS ARE SAFE WITH TIGER.
  • Skerret
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    thanks ol' bigpaws
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • Skerret
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    Suffice to say I saw something which then wasn't there, hence my now destroyed brain.  She haunts my waking dream.
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • Skerret
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    That's waking btw, waking.
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • It is too fucking early. Stupid oz.
  • Skerret
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    How does it feel to be exceeded by your one time outcasts?
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • Moto70
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    You live in the Falklands?
  • Skerret
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    ... Yes.

    No, but we both humour your claim of sovereignty.
    Skerret's posting is ok to trip balls to and read just to experience the ambience but don't expect any content.
    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • Moto70
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    Are you near Melbourne (I think I've asked you this before), my Aunty told me it's a wee bit scorchio at the mo, certainly too hot to carry on with your genetic urge to constantly be out thieving...
  • Skerret
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    I'm in Melbourne you know.  It's a mild 18 or so with a chill wind but intermittent sunshine despite being 7pm.

    Thieving starts at 8:30 anyway, though I may stay in to polish my manacles.
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    "I'm jealous of sucking major dick!"~ Kernowgaz
  • Moto70
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    hehe!
  • Yossarian
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    Interesting read on the psychological effect of success.

    It's quite long, but definitely worth a read, particularly if you're Griff or MK.

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