Retro Gaming - The Bear and Badger

davyK

Unpacked and up and running. It's heavy.

Slightly worried - the original palette was damaged and the shipper had put a red sticker on the packaging to accept and inspect.

However apart from a small bit of superficial damage at the bottom of the cabinet it looks fine (it actually could have been done by me wrestling with it.)

Powered it up and one is reminded about old 80's CRT - you have wait 30 secs or so for the tube to warm up!

The image wasn't steady to begin with - the brightness was flickering up and down a bit and the image size was changing slightly. That seems to have settled down - I'm putting it down to the cold (opening the coin door you could feel very cold air inside - it's probably been sitting in warehouse and containers for a month. I've put it into test mode and it's reporting all is OK.

It seems fine now - will keep an eye on it over the next few days. The display is gorgeous but what hits you is the sound - the bass of the thrust and explosions is simply marvellous - have had to turn the volume WAY down - but I can see me turning that up at parties.

What is slightly disconcerting is the noise the tube itself makes. There is a buzz though you don't notice it while playing but I'm going to mention it to the supplier anyhow.

The game itself is glorious to play - beautiful control and interia - they have it set to 2 lives so I need to tinker with dip switches etc.

There will be pictures....they will not convey the presence this thing has though.

Damn it's big. Wifey has still to get in - there might be hell to pay.

nick_md

Mans trying to get his high score, give him time eh

Olimite

Just say someone broke in and left it there.

davyK

Heh. Have been playing on and off all afternoon and evening. The supplier says there are two pots to tweak that set image size and twiddling those will settle the display issue down. As it stands it's very minor -but I'll have a go at that tomorrow. There's a test pattern you activate to help calibrate the screen size.

It's size of this thing though. Seeing these on video just doesn't convey it. You only ever see them in actuality in an arcade setting - seeing something like this in a house is something else. Will take pics tomorrow and post.

I have a place for it under the stairs in our hall which I think will be the optimal location but I'll take shots of it in our larger living room first.

Eric

Amazing Davy, can't wait to see it. Was it plug in and play or did it need a step down?

wonderbanana

Nice!

Dunno if its the same thing, but with the JAMMA cab monitors you left them on for 30 mins or so before calibrating colour so they could warm up.

davyK

Eric wrote:

Amazing Davy, can't wait to see it. Was it plug in and play or did it need a step down?

The power supply inside the cabinet can deal with 4 different voltages. There are 4 plugs feeding into it and the supplier connected the power cord to the 240v plug. All I had to do was use a US to UK adaptor.

TNT ran it in the US using a step up to test it at 240v.

davyK

wonderbanana wrote:

Nice! Dunno if its the same thing, but with the JAMMA cab monitors you left them on for 30 mins or so before calibrating colour so they could warm up.

Things definitely improved a fair old bit after a couple of hours. Occasionally the height of the display changes momentarily. There is no pattern to it and it doesn't get progressively worse as time passes or anything like that. TNT have said the fix for that is to tweak the vertical height pot on the logic board in the back. That's well away from the scary electronics on the monitor. So I'll give that a go later. When you put it into test mode it displays a test pattern which is useful for calibrating the image height and width so I'll use that.

It still makes a bit of noise but it doesn't seem as bad now - it's something I noticed on youtube videos of this and other vector games so I suppose it's just the technology.

Otherwise everything else is great.

Moot_Geeza

This would probably be the point where I'd start to wonder if Space Invaders could realistically fit alongside it.

nick_md

Davy mate, I work in an office where we have a retro games club with someone refurb-ing a cabinet, someone writing their own NES emulator, several people writing their own games etc etc, I told them about your Asteroids cab and you're the envy of the lot. You have a bunch of people at a London games dev genuinely envious. Live the dream mate, for all of us.

Now where are those fucking pics you cunt?

davyK

I'm actually a bit stressed out about it to be honest. I don't know why. Perhaps it's just the inherent risk of splurging a lot of money on something like this - you really are taking a bit of punt.

Even though I've funded this largely from selling a lot of my old games, I feel a bit guilty for doing it. Weird.

Pictures will come - will get them taken and posted tonight.

poprock

I’m not surprised you’re a bit stressed about the purchase Davy. It’s essentially a selfish thing, and it always feels uncomfortable doing something big for yourself. I get the same weird stress when I buy a car, or whatever. Sort of ‘is it really okay for me to do this just because I want to?’

Moot_Geeza

You showed your workings when you ordered it Davy, it's fiiiine. Plus wifey okay'd it. I would absolutely be stressing about every little hum or flicker though, I don't envy you during the bedding in period.

davyK

Aye. The TNT guy says the minor issue I have should be fixed by a twiddle of the vertical pot as it will wipe the inside of it. It makes sense.

My head is OK with all of this...I spent a lot of time thinking about what game to get and who to get it from - and Wifey's permission was a major piece of the puzzle. It's my gut feeling.... weird feeling this way. However it's telling that when the TNT guy sent me a joke email to return it I didn't want to do that.

I think it's the sheer size of it - it really does have a presence which is part of its brilliance.

wonderbanana

The one thing I learnt from being in the arcade hobby was you need to mentally prepare yourself for things going wrong.

Your risk is arguably lower as its a dedicated and refurbed cab but these are still old electronics and no matter how careful you are sometimes it just happens.

I was quite lucky as my pcb failures were small in number and the lower value ones but it was always a concern.

davyK

Yeah. The risk is lowered with this as they recap everything, reflow solder and clean IC legs etc. But there is always a risk which is increased by getting one shipped from the US. But so far so good.

It's when it's actually there in your house it kind of hits you - no matter how much you think about it in advance.

For a long time I've been wanting to get into basic electronics - the ability to solder / replace components etc. In the main for consoles but it could be a useful skill for this too. I should really use this as the impetus to get off my arse and do something about it.

davyK

Pictures:

How it arrived - note standard garage door width - this thing is big:-

Unboxing - it actually was in a box

Pics of it sitting in the lounge before moving it to its proper home in the hall.

Some closeups: coin door, marque & display, control panel

[Deleted User]

Amazing
So clean and new looking

davyK

It looks great. I'm pleased with how it looks. However - I post these images and I'm a bit downhearted.

The image jitter problem I had seems to have sorted itself out without me resorting to twiddling pots etc. So that was good.

Unfortunately the game has started to malfunction - asteroids all sitting on top of one another and the sound has gone. I put it into test mode and there is an error message. A quick google says it is an audio chip failure.

I've emailed TNT but I'm not sure what they can do.

I moved it to its new location - in a corner in the hall under the stairway which is perfect for it. I left it on for a hour or two and then while playing a few games it started to malfunction. Maybe it's an overheating thing because of the enclosed space? Maybe it will be OK after powering it off for a while. These things run in arcades cheek by jowl with other cabinets so I'm not really convinced of that. Will see.

TNT really know what they are doing but at this distance I'm not sure what they can do. I'm starting to consider cutting my losses if they will take it back or I can get a UK buyer with the skills.

Will wait and see what the supplier says but at this point I'm not hopeful.

[Deleted User]

Hold tight mate.
Speak to TNT, if they can identify the problem they may be able to talk you through steps or suggest an engineer based near you.

wonderbanana

Get yourself over to Jamma+ forums.

I'm sure someone could help, don't give up.

http://www.jammaplus.co.uk/forum/default.asp

Eric

It's a thing of beauty davy even with the issues I'm massively envious. I'm keeping everything crossed that the problem is resolvable matey.

davyK

TNT have come back - I have to say they are quick to respond even allowing for the time difference.

It turns out several of the larger ICs are not soldered in but are in sockets. So I need to make sure they are pressed home tight. Not going to start that this time of night so will try tomorrow evening.

I suppose if anything is to go wrong then the logic board is the best place. It's easy to access and it's easy to take out and work with - and I could get professional help with it if necessary (have a couple of local contacts that do console repair). CRT problems would be more worrying as that is were the scary voltages are etc.

The screen is now performing great - the jitter problem sorted itself out. So I'm hoping this is just some chips that have worked loose after I moved it to its new location. Could be expansion as the cabinet has warned up over the last 24hrs.

Feeling more hopeful now....

Wifey, bless her, is a diamond (in case you haven't sussed that out already). She has "talked me down" a bit this evening. Feeling better. And your posts help too. Need to keep a sense of perspective!

Nina

Looks absolutely great!

And I'm pretty sure you'll get this sorted with TNT's help Davy, don't think it's the first time they're doing this!

And I don't know how they'll ship within the US, but if it's by truck than I think a plane or boat would be the better option! There's a reason people like their trucks and SUV's here, roads aren't the best.

zonipoi

Looks amazing! Hopefully you get it all sorted.

davyK

Nina wrote:

Looks absolutely great! And I'm pretty sure you'll get this sorted with TNT's help Davy, don't think it's the first time they're doing this! And I don't know how they'll ship within the US, but if it's by truck than I think a plane or boat would be the better option! There's a reason people like their trucks and SUV's here, roads aren't the best.

Yeah - the owner , Todd Tuckey (what a great US name) ran arcades in the 80s so he's been around. He's very quick with emails back and has a relaxed tone - no doubt he has seen it all before. I've no doubt if he was up the road he would sort it in a snap - it's the distance that stresses me slightly.

Anyhow - the error message I'm getting is supposed to signal the main audio chip failing but I am getting some sounds out of it. The thrust and explosion sounds are fine - so it may well be a seating problem with all the connections not being made. The placement of the asteroids on top of each other could be a problem with the main game ROM. Thing is the game is behaving normally apart from that - UFOs, ship movement, firing, collisoins, killer satellites, shields, score display etc - all fine.

Maybe it uses a separate RNG chip for asteroid initial placement and that has a problem. The asteroids are all sat on top of each other and they always start from the same position - so whatever is randomly locating them at start of the game isn't doing the business.

Hard to know.

Since the screen jitter sorted itself out , probably due to general warming up, then it's possible the movement of the wooden cabinet and the wooden fitting that holds the PCB will have no doubt flexed a bit so that and me moving the thing around could have slightly unseated socketed chips.

When I get home from work I will open up the back and push down on any IC in a socket and hopefully that will sort things out. I really don't want to give up on it though.

davyK

Socket mounted IC pressing didn't work.

Same problem. I'm now comfortable taking the board out and refitting though.

I can see me now having to get someone to troubleshoot the logic board.....odd the message says audio chip fail when some sounds are working.

Unfortunately the machine gives a sequence of beeps to identify bad ROMs but without the audio firing on all cylinders that might have to be replaced before identifying anything else. Worried now.

Will see what TNT say.

I own a multi-meter so I might be able to troubleshoot this under direction. Will see.

optimark_prime

Geez, what a nightmare. I hope it’s all sorted for you soon Davy, it’s a beautiful looking cabinet.

davyK

Have been doing some googling.

It turns out the sound chip on this is an Atari POKEY. The test mode is saying the audio chip has failed so that points to a failed POKEY (even though I'm getting some sounds).

Thing is. Turns out the POKEY is also a random number generator. I'm willing to bet the game code uses the POKEY to position the asteroids at the start of a wave. If it isn't working then the game code will probably end up positioning them all at the same place - which is what I am experiencing.

I've contacted TNT and as a last roll of the dice asking if it is worth unplugging the POKEY and reseating it.

If that doesn't work then chances are I would need a new POKEY.

I have a BallBlazer cart for the Atari 7800. Guess what it has inside it? Yep. A POKEY. I'd need to check the serial numbers etc. but , if the on board POKEY has failed I have a possible replacement. Don't like BallBlazer - an overrated pile of crap - so more than happy to sacrifice it.

I'd need to get someone with a soldering iron to remove the POKEY from the BallBlazer PCB but the one in my Asteroids is socketed so I should be able to just plug it in.....

Have put this idea to TNT - will see what they say.

Hopeful

davyK

TNT said to try unseating and reseating the POKEY chip. He agrees that's where the problem probably is.

Didn't work.

I think that I'll will need to desolder the POKEY I have (they have the same ID number on them) and try that next.

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