Fallout 76 - The Bear and Badger

AJ

Bob wrote:

If your settlement building your doing it wrong

Raiziel wrote:

AJ is doing exactly what Bethesda wants him to do; his own thing. The settlement stuff is actually pretty good fun, though I never had the patience to pour my imagination into it.

I don't really do the settlements thing properly, but making dioramas is fun.

ZMM

It's like they've taken the worst and least enjoyable bits of Fallout 4 and said "yeah, more of that!"

Fallout 4 was awful apart from Far Harbor imo.

Blocks100

I don't really get you there Pug - they've curtailed settlement building (the most broken bit of FO4) and ramped all the best bits with focus on gunplay and crafting, which were FO4"s strengths.

I'm such a Bethesda apologist that I'd go as far as to say the deletion of NPC's from the world could be a good thing too - no more looping dialogue from passing guards and all that shit. Some of the more memorable quests of FO4 were the ones you got via holotape and discovered recordings - which is FO76 chosen method of quest delivery.

AJ

Doesn't say a lot for F4 if crafting is considered one of its strengths. It's a shit mechanic no matter the game.

Roujin

Pug is correct.

Fallout 4 is basically an FPS wearing Fallout clothes, but it is not a Fallout game, the 'action' is prioritised above everything, to the extent that VATS pausing is gone, a full suit of power armour and a minigun are given to the player to fight a deathclaw in the opening mission and game introduces a faction that has developed technology to the point that the brotherhood of steel shouldn't actually be a problem to defeat (like why don't they just teleport a few corsairs carrying a few mini nukes onto the prywarden as soon as it shows up) at which point the game completely detaches any logical link between the technology in game and the behavior of the Institute.

At no point does the game make any attempt at making the player feel like they inhabit a world where resources are scarce because the game spits resources at you and encourages you to modify high tech equipment that in previous games were only understood by select groups within organisations like the brotherhood, enclave, etc. Then the game offers you the opportunity to stop and build towns from scratch, while at the same time the player is on a desperate hunt for their infant child that is snatched from the arms of your spouse at the start of the game.

It's a big old load of contradictory shite, basically, and making the graphics shiny and making the gunplay better (by Fallout standards) means nothing if it's come at the detriment to the things that for most people, defined the Fallout experience.

Seemingly revenue is now trumping vision at Bethesda and they have identified that as long as the physical aesthetic of post apocalyptic retro futuristic americana is still impressing people as a visual concept, they will lap up anything they push out that's dressed in those clothes. A fucking online PVP game from a studio known primarily for pushing out RPGs which also has persistent world elements that is basically running in the Gamebryo engine, with a load of 3rd party stuff plugged into it for the online, what could people possibly not like about Fallout 76?

Roujin

Roujin wrote:

Pug is correct. Fallout 4 is basically an FPS wearing Fallout clothes, but it is not a Fallout game, the 'action' is prioritised above everything, to the extent that VATS pausing is gone, a full suit of power armour and a minigun are given to the player to fight a deathclaw in the opening mission and game introduces a faction that has developed technology to the point that the brotherhood of steel shouldn't actually be a problem to defeat (like why don't they just teleport a few corsairs carrying a few mini nukes onto the prywarden as soon as it shows up) at which point the game completely detaches any logical link between the technology in game and the behavior of the Institute. At no point does the game make any attempt at making the player feel like they inhabit a world where resources are scarce because the game spits resources at you and encourages you to modify high tech equipment that in previous games were only understood by select groups within organisations like the brotherhood, enclave, etc. Then the game offers you the opportunity to stop and build towns from scratch, while at the same time the player is on a desperate hunt for their infant child that is snatched from the arms of your spouse at the start of the game. It's a big old load of contradictory shite, basically, and making the graphics shiny and making the gunplay better (by Fallout standards) means nothing if it's come at the detriment to the things that for most people, defined the Fallout experience. Seemingly revenue is now trumping vision at Bethesda and they have identified that as long as the physical aesthetic of post apocalyptic retro futuristic americana is still impressing people as a visual concept, they will lap up anything they push out that's dressed in those clothes. A fucking online PVP game from a studio known primarily for pushing out RPGs which also has persistent world elements that is basically running in the Gamebryo engine, with a load of 3rd party stuff plugged into it for the online, what could people possibly not like about Fallout 76?

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE.

Paul the sparky

Let it out Rouj.

Paul the sparky

I was bordering on a massive meltdown in the XCOM 2 thread yesterday.

Paul the sparky

We should have a meltdown/rant thread.

Roujin

I have a bit similar feeling towards XCom 2 to be honest.

I think it's only really that and Fallout that really get me cha-riggered when I see the way both series have ended up (I mean, X-Com was in a downhill slide long before the reboot came about and in it's defence the reboot is possibly the best in the series after the original UFO, sorry Terror from the Deep bois, so I shouldn't really complain, but shiiiiiiiiit did UFO really do some absolutely amazing things for a game made in 1993).

I mean Capcom's latest adventures in fighting game land have been infuriating to watch but Streetfighter doesn't occupy a spot in my heart and it's been enjoyable sifting out the people that like fighting games from the fanbois over the last few years.

Fuck it it's a game at the end of day, BUT THEY WERE MY GAMES WHEN ERRYONE ELSE WAS PLAYING WHATEVER THE FUCK QUAKE OR SOME SHIT IUNNO AT THE TIME REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

AJ

Chill, dude. Just accept it, it's better that way. I'd be a mess if I held a grudge about things from my childhood that had been fucked up. Hell, even if I just limited to things Michael Bay had fucked up.

afgavinstan

Rouj is taking wigs and I Am Here For It

Blocks100

They've delayed the Beta till October. Really what's the point in that? No time to properly tweak gameplay based on player feedback because the full release is in November! And there is massive confusion over who gets to play the Beta. Pre-order was supposed to guarantee access, now It's going to be a 'selection' process. For those who claim Bethesda don't get the Fallout series dark side, they sure know how to be spectacularly underhanded with their own fanbase.

AJ

Blocks100 wrote:

They've delayed the Beta till October. Really what's the point in that?

Infrastructure load testing.

AJ

Also, fuck making changes based on player feedback; most players don't understand shit and listening to them has screwed things up too many times.

AJ

So, they've done the cool thing with griefers, as hoped, but the more info that comes out, the less it sounds like something I want to play.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-08-11-griefing-in-fallout-76-turns-you-into-a-wanted-criminal-with-a-bounty-on-your-head

Blocks100

The card pack perk system is a tad confusing. Do I get to choose the perks I get, or is it all down to the randomness of the draw?

Also, I wish they would lay off the use of Vault boy. In the early days, vault boy was just a one-off thing, appearing in the Vault Tec information reels. Now it's a ubiquitous mascot that's plastered across the UI and gameworld. I supposed it reflects the cartoon direction that Bethesda are taking with the franchise, but I'm beginning to tire of it.

Roujin

The only thing these issues reflect is that Bethesda don't understand or more likely don't care about maintaining the IP, they see everything that could be a marketable asset as just that, regardless of whether using things in that fashion makes any sense.

They are literally banking on the fact they think people are too stupid or don't care that they are dressing anything up in fallout clothes, they will just buy it because it says fallout on it, and reusing assets from fallout to make this game instead of inventing a new IP for their online/offline single player/coop 3rd person action shooter thing saved them money meaning more profits, which it should be clear by now, is all Bethesda are interested in. The possible exception being Elder Scrolls 6 because the Fallout nerds are one thing, but those thirsty fantasy rpg bois and girls are a much bigger audience probably.

Bob

Presumably 3 and 4 sold a shit ton more than 1 and 2?

Roujin

Well 1 & 2 were an iso turn based RPG on PC only and 3 and 4 were AAA multiplatform titles with nicer graphics and more action so you'd hope they sold a shit ton more.

Sales figures are not a measure of artistic or design merit though so REEEEE or something I guess. F1 & F2 are some of the best best written RPGs of all time. F3 was ground-breaking for bringing the franchise into the modern era, New Vegas saw the original team members from 1&2 returning to deliver easily the best of the new games even if it was rushed out on and more buggy than 3. 4 shat the bed and went full dumb action movie, shit thought it was Terminator 2 when really it was any of the films after T2 you hated the most.

Bob

I'm not suggesting it's of artistic merit.. just that they're persuing the route to most sales.. if that shits on the franchise's previous lore.. doesn't seem to bother them.

Roujin

Yeah it doesn't, because they're cunts who are so nakedly more interested in maximising their profits than anything else it seems, because how else this came to be a fallout game I've no idea.

Sucks to watch a once fresh and interesting franchise getting flushed down the toilet.

Blocks100

Turning a resolutely singleplayer franchise into multiplayer (and ostracizing a large part of your fanbase in the process) seems an odd route to take to pursue the most sales.

Roujin

Not if you are chasing the trend of multiplayer online games as a platform for microtransaction fuckery and you have an existing popular IP that can shift copies on name alone and using it's existing assets saves you the cost of developing new ones.

Roujin

I mean the in-game content store that was added after release to F4 is starting to make pretty clear sense now.

Blocks100

Despite 76's new 'card pack' perk system being rife for microtransactions, Hines has confirmed that the only way to get new cards is to level-up in game, not buy 'em.

'Creation Club' has never made any sense, now or in the future. It's churned out useless cosmetic junk, not story based content like what people wanted. And there's no chance of mods happening (paid-for or otherwise) in '76 as that is only possible with private servers - which they have said are a long way off.

Roujin

Cosmetic junk is the only thing you can get away with selling to players in multiplayer online games since EA overdid it on Star Wars Battlefront 2 and the backlash affected everyone.

Had EA not got so high on the smell of their own farts, this card system would absolutely have been monetized in my opinion.

Roujin

I MEAN ITS CARDS! FUCKING PACKS OF DIGITAL CCG CARDS! THEIR ONLY PURPOSE IS TO BE SOLD IN PACKS! Otherwise they'd have chosen some other maguffin that's vaguely fallouty instead.

I swear any time I see a multiplayer game from a big developer with card based anything post SWBF2, you can bet your ass that was going to be a revenue stream.

Blocks100

People didn't have any problems with buying cards when they were Panini.

Roujin

Panini never made you pay £30 for the album to put the stickers in. They also didn't come back 5-10 years later and take your album back off you. They also didn't make it impossible to trade swaps or sell rare stickers.

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