Halo, is it me you're looking for? - The Bear and Badger

RedDave2

LivDiv wrote:

Yeah.
"Hey everyone we are a totally shit developer. Play our game coming later this year".

Some heads need a good wobble in this thread.

Was thinking the same. If you read between the lines that is what seems to be seeing said but are we really saying a developer should say that they fucked up in press releases?

Diluted Dante

In fairness to 343 (words I never thought I'd say) plenty of games have awful implementation of co-op saving, quite often the one they go for being "Only player 1 can save"

GurtTractor

RedDave2 wrote:

Was thinking the same. If you read between the lines that is what seems to be seeing said but are we really saying a developer should say that they fucked up in press releases?

Like actually yes, maybe. Being open about mistakes/failures and making statements of how you will fix stuff is fine, plenty of devs do it and the majority of players respect them for it. Trying to sweep things under the carpet or pretend that everything is just hunky dory will usually leave a bad taste. I'm speaking generally here, not saying that 343 are particularly guilty of that.

They don't have to be too utterly grovelling and harsh on themselves of course, just some acknowledgement that things aren't quite ideal but they are doing what they can is totally fine. Making fairly weak excuses that apologists can regurgitate is just annoying.

Yossarian

I don't know about that, people will always want to know why something went wrong. I think more people would be unhappy at no reason being given than a straight up "sorry, this isn't ready yet, it's coming later" (which 343 did cover in the interview).

LivDiv

They said Coop wont be available at launch.
I'm not sure what more they need to say. Does it really matter if Guss heading up save point coding fucked it or Will the timing manager didnt scroll far enough down the spreadsheet of tasks?
Shit happens on massively complex projects, shit happens on not massively complex projects.

Shareholders might be justified in asking why, Im not sure why consumers need to know the detailed ins and outs of operations. Just accept the fact and get over it.
The alternatives are a delay to the whole game, a broken game at launch or excessive crunch which still might lead to the first two.

g.man

If 343 put out a statement about how badly they'd fucked this all up, the game would be dead in the water. The entire amateur gaming media on the internet (YouTubers and suchlike) would be on them like vultures, and I doubt they'd weather that storm.
Me? I'd be more impressed if they just launched the multiplayer component this year, and put the campaign back another year. I suspect they're in a sticky position now where they're damned if they launch, and damned if they don't.

Djornson

Yeah the guy made up some BS. I'd rather he just said look we didn't get it in done in time. But ya'll dramaticising

Yossarian

He pretty much did say that, he was then asked why and added some additional details.

Yossarian

If you’re going to criticise his messaging, probably best to watch the interview it came from rather than base it on some quotes taken out of context.

yourfavouriteuncle

g.man wrote:

If 343 put out a statement about how badly they'd fucked this all up, the game would be dead in the water. The entire amateur gaming media on the internet (YouTubers and suchlike) would be on them like vultures, and I doubt they'd weather that storm.
Me? I'd be more impressed if they just launched the multiplayer component this year, and put the campaign back another year. I suspect they're in a sticky position now where they're damned if they launch, and damned if they don't.

I was thinking this might be a better option for all involved. The test event seemed really positive from the little feedback I saw (only on here) so that’s obviously in a place they feel happy to show. Surely give the SP another year under the new management and launch the multiplayer stuff. It’s not like they need to rush the full game out to get a big influx of money back in - gp kinda negates any big numbers for first party stuff - so I don’t think release timings are all that important here. Other than face saving “see, we only needed a year to fix it so it wasn’t that bad” kinda argument, I don’t get what the impending rush would be?

Moot_Geeza

I reckon they should've kept it a secret and had Craig wagging his finger saying ah-ah-ah! when you try to select co-op.

Cos

Moot_Geeza wrote:

I reckon they should've kept it a secret and had Craig wagging his finger saying ah-ah-ah! when you try to select co-op.

That's gold.

Yossarian

Just came across this:

https://www.reddit.com/r/halo/comments/p8ifq9/about_the_delays_343_employee_dev/

Could be bollocks, of course, but interesting if not.

Tl;dr: there’s been a bit of shuffling of the campaign components since Staten came on board, which from the sounds of things, may well be for the better. And co-op saving does indeed sound tricky, assuming it’s true.

tigersgogrrr

Seems very reasonable and likely.

LivDiv

Originally, it was a lot more Tom Clancy Wildlands, almost Just Cause at times. The core of the experience was Halo gameplay wise, but there was a lot of 'clear X structures in any order to unlock the next campaign mission' and Joseph really hated that.

Thank god they changed that.

g.man

Really? I would have though that was the basic design philosophy of every open world game I've ever played? Obviously some games integrate this philosophy better than others, but it's hard to see how you'd do an open-worlder significantly differently to that...unless your game was just an absolute grind-fest.

afgavinstan

Thought this was an interesting thread

https://twitter.com/heytred/status/1429577280163041283?s=19

Also yeah folks, calm the fuck down lmao.

LivDiv

@g
It read like box ticking to me.
I would rather have specific missions tied to a story to open up the next area and that stuff be optional extras which seems to be what they have now gone for.

Yossarian

g.man wrote:

Really? I would have though that was the basic design philosophy of every open world game I've ever played? Obviously some games integrate this philosophy better than others, but it's hard to see how you'd do an open-worlder significantly differently to that...unless your game was just an absolute grind-fest.

Doing it differently seemed to work out okay for Breath of the Wild.

GurtTractor

There's loads of potential to have a much more dynamic and non-linear single player experience in an open world, but it will require a bit of a shift away from the traditional authored experience. Like I'd really love to see a new GTA with a far more simulated and reactive world, Elder Scrolls too. I think big devs could learn a lot from some of the things modern roguelikes are doing.

I'm not saying that a new Halo would need that necessarily, but it would be cool to see in other games.

Yossarian

afgavinstan wrote:

Thought this was an interesting thread https://twitter.com/heytred/status/1429577280163041283?s=19 Also yeah folks, calm the fuck down lmao.

Just read this, really good thread, the IGN article it linked to was really interesting too.

https://www.ign.com/articles/turns-out-hardest-part-making-game-everything

b0r1s

December 8th

b0r1s

The special edition console looks horrific.

g.man

Yeah, we’re launching the campaign at the same time as multiplayer on Dec 8th… but we’re not actually ready to show it to you…

b0r1s

Yeah bit weird that.

g.man

Doesn’t inspire confidence.

Yossarian

Campaign footage would have been nice, but on the other hand, they do kind of have to knock it out of the park with the next showing. If they ain't done polishing, showing it again now could do more harm than good.

I_R

FPS campaigns do feel like something more people are going to dislike than like these days. The kids don't care and the old people care too much about the mess of a Halo story.

LivDiv

The console doesn't look too bad for a Halo themed console.
I noticed it is 2tb, the regular X is only 1tb right?

There seems to be a growing consensus of maybe delay the campaign but seems like MS want it out this year.

Paul the sparky

I don't like the look of it, or the pad

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