Strength [+2] - The Bear and Badger

Skerret

I was thinking I might have a go at a 1RM next week. Mixed grip; I can manage a couple of reps at double overhand at that weight but my right gives out too soon so I just start with mixed once it gets to my work weight so I don't have to switch mid-set. Feels pretty clean coming up though.

Next step would be 200kg single I think, so will resume incremental increases until I can hit whatever weight and reps theoretically equals 200 then go again.

cockbeard

Always wondered what are 'normal' relationships between various compound lifts. I've noodle arms but my chest and shoulders can take a bit more weight. But if I take a few basic compounds, what would the expectation be. Rough and ready figures (albeit a year old) show this

Exercise - Bodyweight%
Squat - 135
Dead - 110
OHPress - 55
BenchPress - 90
BentRow - 80

Makes me think my OHP is terrible, but no-one likes working above their own head

Skerret

Rough guide is 2-2.5xBW for deadlift, 2 for squat, 1.5 for bench, 0.8-1 for OHP,all 1RM. If you are producing that you are dong pretty ok.

cockbeard

Way below that, even further below the above right now. Just intrigued as to whether the OHP was crazy low, comparatively. Yes I know it's mad that dead is lower than squat but I think that's because I never reached limit with deads

Skerret

Not that mad at the upper ends, some guys/gals/people have higher squat than dead.

I don't think the OHP is crazy low, it's a bastard to progress on and will move more slowly than the other lifts. If you dedicate some serious time to it over bench you'd see an increase. I doubt I'll ever bench again, it's all cables for me now.

hylian_elf

Not been lifting since start of New Year as I’ve been concentrating on running and training for the half-marathon, but my PBs in respect of BW% as at 31/12/18 were broadly:

Squat: 1.67
Bench: 1.25
Deadlift: 2.1
Press: 0.73
Row (Pendlay): 1.25

Still a bit to go before I can say I’ve hit intermediate (or are those ratios Skerret listed for advanced?) levels of lifting.

hylian_elf

^talking about calculated 1RM in above. I can’t actually get that for actual 1RM testing except for OHP strangely. Maybe I get too nervous on the others and pre-suppose that I’d fail.

And yes. I’ve seen plenty of people squat more than they can deadlift. Even in actual powerlifting comps. Quite a bit of it depends on limb and torso lengths and ratios. I suppose someone with short legs and long arms can deadlift a fucktonne. And long femurs will fuck your squat?

voices

1/1.5/2/2.5 could be 'advanced', depending on what your body weight is. More 'intermediate' goals might be something like 0.7/1.2/1.5/2, though I've seen even lower thrown out for bench (i.e. 1 times bw, which feels low to me).

cockbeard wrote:

Makes me think my OHP is terrible, but no-one likes working above their own head

Working overhead is the best! I much prefer it to bench, which you can't push to failure without a spotter (that is probably more likely to mess up your grindy reps than save you from a fail), or squats/deads where failure will cause your heart to explode.

cockbeard

I normally bench in a rack for the very reason. Overhead work is best for the same reason no one likes working overhead, even painting a ceiling or stripping artex, damn hard work

I think they look good figures elf, mine are also calculated, no idea what algorithm, whatever Jefit uses as these are across some old logs. Hoping to get be at those again in a month then able to check progress beyond that

Speedhaak

Skerret wrote:

Next step would be 200kg single I think

Nice milestone that. Could never quite gel with under-hand reverse grips so still using hookgrip.

Had a 90kg OH Squat for 3 rep PR last week at 78kg b/w. With the wedding late last year (abroad) I was pretty tired and not hitting any decent numbers. Feeling better now though and have the Celtic Series this weekend.

hylian_elf

I hate asking people to spot me for bench and I get too self-conscious using a rack with safety bars on, so I don’t end up pushing myself very hard on bench.

Tried lots of times to get a mate to go gym same time as me to spot my bench but he has his own routine.

Speedhaak

Why don't you just press from the floor? Less need for a spotter then and you can go heavy.

Lord_Griff

Smith machine?

hylian_elf

Speedhaak wrote:

Why don't you just press from the floor? Less need for a spotter then and you can go heavy.

lolwut?! Interesting. Can you actually get full ROM?

voices

Floor press is a thing, but it's a different ROM from bench. For me it's a better choice than the smith machine, which has a different movement profile. Maybe both are decent accessories, but having said that you don't have to be risking failure on bench to be making progress.

Jaco

NEVER bench without a spotter. That's how I tore out my rotary cuff a few years back. Because I'm a moron.

As Griff said, a Smith machine is your answer. Or ask one of the PTs at your gym – they'll always spot you and know how to do it properly so you get a proper workout to failure.

Speedhaak

hylian_elf wrote:

Speedhaak wrote:

Why don't you just press from the floor? Less need for a spotter then and you can go heavy.

lolwut?! Interesting. Can you actually get full ROM?

Yeah it's a thing, with regards to ROM you obviously can't go beyond your elbow resting on the ground. I find it is a nice alternative to benching. And due to it's ROM limits you can dump the bar on a failed rep.

hylian_elf

Smith machines in my gym are horrible. They go straight up rather than up and back. Even if they did go up and back, might not be right angle for the way I bench.

I’ve asked a PT before and he was an idiot. Most of them are cos they think they know more etc and act like experts when they’re not.

voices

Jaco wrote:

NEVER bench without a spotter. That's how I tore out my rotary cuff a few years back. Because I'm a moron. As Griff said, a Smith machine is your answer. Or ask one of the PTs at your gym – they'll always spot you and know how to do it properly so you get a proper workout to failure.

I'm not sure how a spotter would have prevented that, and I would think that the smith machine will put a lot more pressure on your shoulders because of the compromised bottom position.

Lord_Griff

Smith machine isn't perfect but it is marginally better than asphyxiation, unless, you know, you're into that sort of thing.

voices

Also don't go to failure every session - that's a recipe for messing up your tendons etc as form falters.

cockbeard

hylian_elf wrote:

I hate asking people to spot me for bench and I get too self-conscious using a rack with safety bars on, so I don’t end up pushing myself very hard on bench.

Tried lots of times to get a mate to go gym same time as me to spot my bench but he has his own routine.

Forget self conscious, get in the rack. I only feel a dick doing it if it's a very busy time of day and all the racks are full. Yet I often see dickheads using a rack to do pull ups on. There's bars everywhere you morons. If someone is that impatient to use the rack then maybe they offer to spot your bench and you alternate work/rest

cockbeard

Lord_Griff wrote:

Smith machine isn't perfect but it is marginally better than asphyxiation, unless, you know, you're into that sort of thing.

Well that's me almost tumescent

Jaco

voices wrote:

Jaco wrote:

NEVER bench without a spotter. That's how I tore out my rotary cuff a few years back. Because I'm a moron. As Griff said, a Smith machine is your answer. Or ask one of the PTs at your gym – they'll always spot you and know how to do it properly so you get a proper workout to failure.

I'm not sure how a spotter would have prevented that, and I would think that the smith machine will put a lot more pressure on your shoulders because of the compromised bottom position.

I was benching 150Kg, thought I was almost at failure, decided to push one more out (because, as stated, I'm a moron), couldn't get it up or onto the hooks, had no one in the weights room to grab it for me, just about managed to push/roll it off sideways so I didn't die but it was too late for my right shoulder. Which is cooked :-(

Like I said. MORON.

voices

Lord_Griff wrote:

Smith machine isn't perfect but it is marginally better than asphyxiation, unless, you know, you're into that sort of thing.

at anything less than 150 or so I think you should be fine, just have some bruised ribs and diaphragm (which sounds pretty bad). Unless you drop the bar on your face from the top, in which case what the fuck were you doing?

cockbeard

voices wrote:

Unless you drop the bar on your face from the top, in which case what the fuck were you doing?

Although the fear of that certainly helps with 'neural engagement' if that's what they call it

Same fear that got me into the rack

Skerret

Going for volume on OHP which seems to be working, up to 9 reps @ 50kg then drop 10% and +1 rep so I don't burn out at the business end. Certainly packing on size pretty quickly. Lots to be said for low weight and high controlled reps given how many tendon and minor muscle group injuries I've had. Deadlift is mylast and only big liftz just going to hover around 100 and high reps for squat. 3 plates is still a pipe dream with my femurs.

afgavinstan

I dunno if I'm better asking here or Witness The Fitness but here goes.

Back at the gym getting myself in shape to get back playing football after a knee injury over two years ago. Obviously I'm putting more importance on getting stability and strength back in my legs, but overall bulking up and adding weight & muscle is part of the overall plan. I'm 6'4", 72kg.

But I'm finding it hard to get my calories up. My appetite isn't huge by any means so I just find myself struggling to finish larger portions so I end up snacking on cereal and toast & peanut butter to help. So I ask, what's some good ideas for clean high cal stuff I can make or buy to snack on? Already on some maximuscle shake and all that entails etc etc.

cockbeard

Eating for growth is a chore, not because of bad food, you can throw flavours at stuff, it's just hard work eating those sort of numbers. For me anything faddy is pointless, it has to be easy and interesting enough that yo don't stop looking forward to eating. I pick up turkey breasts and fish portions for freezing, various veg, depending on what's seasonal. Also loads of packs of part cooked brown rice. Cook all the veg at once and freeze into portion sized bags, start of each day make two meals up into tupperware

But really whatever you normally eat/buy I'd say the easiest thing is to do exactly the same but look for a version with less processing and packaging. The best diet is the one you stick with, and we all stick with things that are easiest

hylian_elf

Fluids are a good way to increase calories and protein intake. Chug down some full fat milk every now and then through the day? Clean-ish mass gainer protein shakes are expensive and actually quite filling so you don’t end up eating as much for proper meals. Cheaper mass gainers are full of crappy sugars.

You could just take a slow approach. Increase meal size gradually. Your stomach will adapt.

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