The Write Stuff - NKOTB tribute thread - The Bear and Badger

tigersgogrrr

Nice work. Novels are beyond daunting. To even finish a draft is an accomplishment.

Chief

Thanks. It took me the better part of five years, plus a complete reset after I'd written about 40-50 pages.

tin_robot

Chief wrote:

I finished writing my first novel last year, will start editing it from tomorrow with a view to getting it published later in the year. I know it'll be a long process and there's a mountain of work ahead of me, but I'm realistic about my chances and well and truly ready to work for this.

You're already doing better than me. I wrote mine, but have then sat on it ever since. I think I had some weird fantasy that writing it would be the hard part. (I sent it to all of 2 agents, one of whom said they liked it but didn't know what to do with it, and the other ignored me completely.) I've told myself that this year I should either have a proper attempt at getting it published, or stop moaning, self publish so it's out there, and get on with writing the next one as that's the bit I actually enjoy...

Dark Soldier

Definitely try to get it published. Better a publishing house than self promotion for months.

I'll be writing soon again too, but I worry what I want to write is too bleak for a publishing house.

tigersgogrrr

Finished the draft. Now to read it back and crai.

My novel has gone absolutely nowhere. Find it very difficult to write lengthy. Still working on my NaNoWriMo effort from last year. It's only on about 10k, ffs. Keep deleting it all due to self-loathing.

DS, have you read much horror stuff that's out there? I have no idea how bleak the genre goes. Must be a market somewhere though. People like dark.

tigersgogrrr

Found this interesting... (spoilered for reasonable length). From here - http://ttapress.com/1774/ralph-robert-moore-interviewed/0/5/ DREAD FICTION

Spoiler:

[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif] I've always been struck by the fact that a lot of what we call "horror stories", although they certainly qualify as being a part of that genre, really aren't that horrifying.[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]Many stories within the set of what we identify as horror stories are, to me, "stories of reassurance".[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]My comment was that to me, a story that in its entirety evokes true horror (in the sense of the emotion rather than the classification), has to have as its basic element a sense of "unfairness" (rather than, "without hope").[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]Two examples:[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]The protagonist goes through life causing harm to others. He rapes, steals, murders, doesn't return his library books when they're due. At the end of the story, he's dispatched in a horrific way that's often specific to his crimes (i.e., someone who causes misery by stealing is drugged and his organs are stolen, etc.) That to me is a story of reassurance. The reader is reassured that bad people eventually get their due. The world is fair. But real horror is not bad things happening to bad people. That's reassurance. Real horror is bad things happening to good people. That's unfairness.[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]The protagonist faces a great evil that appears invincible, but at the last possible moment, just as the story is about to end, he or she finds something to defeat that evil (Christine: A big garbage truck; Day of the Triffids: seawater.) Once again, the reader is reassured the world is fair.[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]Neither of these examples necessarily result in bad fiction. But the scenarios don't truly horrify (even though they may have some horrific scenes). They reassure. The lesson we're taught is, the world is ultimately fair.[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]The movie Alien is a story of reassurance. People die, but the overall message is that evil is defeated.[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]Texas Chainsaw Massacre is not a story of reassurance. One person survives, although who knows in what mental state, but that family is still there, sharpening the big metal teeth on their chainsaw, waiting for the next set of victims. Leatherface is not punished for what he did.[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]So my point was that within the diverse world of what we refer to as horror is a subgenre of stories that are "true" horror stories in that they don't reassure the reader, and the way in which they don't reassure the reader is by having a central thesis of unfairness. For the sake of discussion, we can call this subgenre "Dread Fiction."[/font]
[font=Book Antiqua', Palatino, Georgia, 'Palatino Linotype', serif]I'm being rather long-winded, and I'm only on my first answer, but let me just add that when I say "true" horror I don't mean that use of "true" to suggest there's something inferior to stories of reassurance. A lot of what I write, a lot of what most of us write, falls under "Stories of Reassurance".[/font]

Dark Soldier

I've read some bleak stuff, aye. It feels like a limited market as such though (Ketchum is the stand out). But still, as they say, write what you love. I even tried a love story once, which ended with the two women who desired the men murdering each other

EDIT: Nice link. My novel would open with a 12yo boy witnessing his brother being hanged, so yeah, which leads to repercussions of being haunted by it when we join him in adult life.

I'll always hold The Wasp Factory as an example of bleak done beautiful.

tigersgogrrr

No doubt, gotta writes what you likes. And there's no doubting that particularly bleak stuff has a smaller market than, say, Young Farmer Becomes Ultimate Dragon Warrior And Saves The World.

Still, I guess it depends how you approach it. The Wasp Factory is fucking dark in places, but Banks made it work. Only book to make me cry.

Dark Soldier

The Road made me cry, but I could never hope to write near that level without ideals of copying the great one.

tigersgogrrr

Daunting, eh.

I've just tidied up my the short story I was working on yesterday and this afternoon. If anyone is willing to have a read, I've love some opinions. Have it as .docx & .mobi.

Dark Soldier

If its .mobi and works on Kindle, I'll actually read it this time

tigersgogrrr

Yaaay. I should still have your e-mail. Will send it now.

Dark Soldier

Cheers chap

tigersgogrrr

Done.

Chief

tin_robot wrote:

Chief wrote:

I finished writing my first novel last year, will start editing it from tomorrow with a view to getting it published later in the year. I know it'll be a long process and there's a mountain of work ahead of me, but I'm realistic about my chances and well and truly ready to work for this.

You're already doing better than me. I wrote mine, but have then sat on it ever since. I think I had some weird fantasy that writing it would be the hard part. (I sent it to all of 2 agents, one of whom said they liked it but didn't know what to do with it, and the other ignored me completely.) I've told myself that this year I should either have a proper attempt at getting it published, or stop moaning, self publish so it's out there, and get on with writing the next one as that's the bit I actually enjoy...

The writing is definitely the best part. I should say that it was around Summer when I finished writing the novel last year, it's been sat around for six months. I told myself that I was busy with other things (December was the only month I could honestly claim that) but the truth is I was terrified of going back and finding it was shit, or of finishing it and then have agents/publishers tell me it's worthless.

Now though? I know it'll be a long and difficult road, maybe even ending with me self-publishing, but I'm really pushing myself to get my writing career started. I'm miserable at my job and need to move on, enjoy life again.

@tigerswiftly I don't think I could write another long novel again, it's difficult to write such a large story. I've already decided that the sequel will either be a novella or a series of short stories, keeping me from running out of ideas or stretching the story beyond its limits.

tigersgogrrr

I'd love to write a novel. That's the eventual goal, for sure. Trying to build up my writing confidence through shorter stories first though, all the while chipping away and growing THE WORLD.

Has anyone submitted to TTA press before? Any idea of turnaround times? Submitted one story to them today (Garden 9) and will be submitting my needing-a-title horror short tomorrow after a few more edits. If you have any suggestions for a title, DS, I'm all ears. Was originally going to be about a Kafka-esque journey to reach the lighthouse, hence the original name... story has undergone something of a transformation!

Pretty stumped for a title, actually. "The Lighthouse (not really lol)" would be a good 'un.

Dark Soldier

The Marble Island?

I'm rubbish at titles to be honest, The Lighthouse is sound seeing as its so imperative to the story. Simpler the better.

tigersgogrrr

That exact title has occurred to me, actually.

I think I prefer The Lighthouse though - As you say, it works. Thanks.

Chief

No idea what I'm doing when it comes to editing a novel, but I started today with the help of a friend. It's a simpler process than I expected, but I know it'll take a long time. Good to go back and read the first chapter again, having given it a good while so I can look at it with fresh eyes.

Dark Soldier

Does it still read well?

Chief

Not too bad, actually. No glaring mistakes, just a few bits that need reworking to clarify certain points. I can certainly see where I've improved since, though.

Dark Soldier

Always a good thing chap! I wish you Godspeed for the challenge ahead.

Chief

Thanks, man.

Rev

Think I'll get the forum tale finished of by the end of the month then start writing some things that have been buzzing about my head.
Would like to see the finished Garden nine story please tiger?

tigersgogrrr

Ok. Will send it over to ya. Will also fire you The Lighthouse if you like?

Do you want .mobi? Or just a word file?

Rev

Word file is fine my good man

tigersgogrrr

Cheers, bow-wow. Have sent.

Look forward to hearing what you think. x

tigersgogrrr

You can get a free copy of Interzone (who publish sci-fi & fantasy) on Smashwords. https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/60013#download
They're open to unsolicited submissions, so anyone on here who likes a dabble in that style-o'fiction might want to check out the sorts of things they do publish.

Clarkesworld seems like a decent bet too, actually, and have tonnes of free stuff to read. And they do a podcast with people reading out some of the stories too, which is nice. Gonna have a listen while I do the washing up later.

Dark Soldier

I'd love to write Sci Fi. May give it a crack at some point.

tigersgogrrr

Got my first rejection today.

That's a landmark, I guess. Onwards and upwards and oh god someone kill me now.

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